i><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/certain-wp-form-plugins-make-accessibility-easy#what-about-other-wp-form-plugins\">What About Other WP Form Plugins?</a></li><li><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/certain-wp-form-plugins-make-accessibility-easy#some-form-plugins-accessibility-efforts-seem-reactive-rather-than-proactive\">Some Form Plugins’ Accessibility Efforts Seem Reactive Rather Than Proactive</a></li><li><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/certain-wp-form-plugins-make-accessibility-easy#what-about-accessibility-on-the-admin-end-of-wp-form-plugins\">What About Accessibility on the Admin End of WP Form Plugins?</a></li><li><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/certain-wp-form-plugins-make-accessibility-easy#notes\">Notes</a></li><li><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/certain-wp-form-plugins-make-accessibility-easy#comments\">Comments ↓</a></li></ol>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"gravity-forms-investments-in-web-accessibility-are-paying-dividends\">Gravity Forms’ Investments in Web Accessibility Are Paying Dividends</h2>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"https://wptavern.com/gravity-forms-2-5-launches-with-an-overhauled-ui-and-focus-on-accessibility\">The Tavern reported</a> in 2021 that <a href=\"https://www.gravityforms.com/\">Gravity Forms</a> invested heavily in web accessibility with their 2.5 release and also reported that Gravity Forms provides lots of information about <a href=\"https://docs.gravityforms.com/gravity-forms-commitment-to-accessibility/\">their approach to accessibility</a>.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I was curious to dive deeper on Gravity Forms’ specific web accessibility processes.  </p>\n\n\n\n<p>“We do our testing with keyboard and screen readers,” <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/gwendydd/\">Morgan Kay</a>, a software engineer at Gravity Forms who works closely with accessibility initiatives at the company says.&nbsp; </p>\n\n\n\n<p>“We also consider some other implications, such as how usable a feature is on mobile, how it looks in an RTL language, and whether we have sufficient color contrast.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Gravity Forms also tries to help novice users understand when they are making a change that might break accessibility.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“One thing Gravity Forms does that&#8217;s particularly valuable is that it warns you if you&#8217;re using a feature that has known accessibility issues,&nbsp; and that&#8217;s a huge time saver for professionals,” says web accessibility consultant, <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/joedolson/\">Joe Dolson</a>.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"is-wcag-aa-compliant-enough-what-about-wcag-aaa-compliance\">Is WCAG AA-Compliant Enough?&nbsp; What about WCAG <em>AAA</em>-Compliance?</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Gravity Forms promises WCAG AA compliance, which is a great place to start for anyone who is looking to make a website more accessible to users.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“WCAG2.1 AA is the standard required by most accessibility laws,” says Gravity Forms’ Kay.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>By comparison, “WCAG2.1 <em>AAA</em> is very strict, and includes some standards that are not necessarily realistic or necessary for all types of websites,” Kay adds.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“Our goal is to make sure that [our forms] comply to WCAG 2.1AA,” says Kay. “This is not only because we want our forms to be accessible, but also because it is required by some countries.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“We provide tools that let users build forms that are WCAG-compliant, but it is still ultimately up to the user to make sure they are following all of the guidelines to meet those requirements,” adds Kay.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I tested that statement in the wild, and it’s true: Gravity Forms gives you all the tools to make your front-end form WCAG AA-compliant out-of-the-box and without any configuration.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>For example, if you simply add name, email, and phone fields to a Gravity Form, it’ll be WCAG AA compliant.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>However, website owners can optionally or unknowingly break compliance &#8211; and often do.&nbsp; For example, deleting the default form labels will break compliance.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>You don’t have to go far on the web to run into a text input field without a proper label.&nbsp; Oftentimes this is done for aesthetic reasons &#8211; e.g. hiding labels to make the form more compact.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"what-about-other-wp-form-plugins\">What About Other WP Form Plugins?</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>While other form plugins might be able to create accessible forms, they aren’t as simple to configure for WCAG and ADA compliance, according to some accessibility consultants.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“For free plugins, Contact Form 7 allows you to create very accessible forms,&nbsp; but you have to know what you&#8217;re doing. It&#8217;s a fine tool if you put in the work, but I wouldn&#8217;t recommend it to the average user,” <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/joedolson/\">Dolson</a> says.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Another web accessibility consultant, <a href=\"http://linkedin.com/in/gslacdao/\">Gerson Lacdao</a> noted his appreciation for Gravity Forms’ efforts while adding some constructive criticism of other WP form plugins.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“Some [form plugins] have issues in the most basic [web accessibility] things like properly coded field labels,” says Lacdao.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>His favorite form plugin today is <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/plugins/ws-form/\">WS Form</a>.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“In terms of accessibility, I would probably put [the WS Form plugin] on top,” Lacdao says. “I like how a lot of accessibility options are available [in WS Form], and I don&#8217;t need to add extra CSS or JS hacks just to make it work better.”</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"some-form-plugins-accessibility-efforts-seem-reactive-rather-than-proactive\">Some Form Plugins’ Accessibility Efforts Seem Reactive Rather Than Proactive</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Lacdao mentioned one example of a popular WP form plugin that is behind on the web accessibility front (I was unable to reach the plugin’s developer for comment and therefore decided to not name the plugin here).&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“[That plugin’s accessibility] efforts are mostly reactive and for now only based on tickets or feedback from some users,” says Lacdao. “It&#8217;s something I&#8217;m a bit frustrated about because I feel like it&#8217;s part of their obligation to users to proactively make their product accessible.”&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>In addition to making a clear proactive effort on the web accessibility front, the Gravity Forms team is always on the lookout for new issues.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Gravity Forms’ Kay explains, “We usually investigate [accessibility tickets] as soon as they are reported, and we can usually get [them] fixed within one or two minor releases.”</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"what-about-accessibility-on-the-admin-end-of-wp-form-plugins\">What About Accessibility on the Admin End of WP Form Plugins?</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>It’s tough to talk about web accessibility in the admin side of any plugin without talking about accessibility in the admin of WordPress more generally.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Based on my tests using the WAVE tool, neither WordPress core nor <em>any</em> plugin or theme I tested fared well on web accessibility within the admin.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>That said, admin-side accessibility improvements are definitely on Gravity Forms’ agenda.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>&nbsp;“[A senior accessibility consultant] has done a complete audit of our plugin in the dashboard, so we know what we need to do to make Gravity Forms accessible in the admin,” Kay said. “We are working on making the admin accessible, and in Gravity Forms 2.9 there will be some improvements.”&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"notes\">Notes</h2>\n\n\n\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https://wave.webaim.org/extension/\">WAVE</a> is the testing tool promoted by WebAIM and also used by many web accessibility consultants as a data point for figuring out how a webpage is doing on the accessibility front.&nbsp; It’s not a perfect tool, but it is a great place to start.</li>\n\n\n\n<li>I reached out to WP Forms, Ninja Forms, and Forminator Pro in addition to Gravity Forms for inclusion in this article. Only Gravity Forms responded meaningfully to my requests for comment. I encourage other form plugin developers to leave their thoughts in the comments.</li>\n</ul>\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-post-author-biography\">Toby Cryns is a freelance CTO, WordPress consultant, and teacher at <a href=\"https://themightymo.com/\">The Mighty Mo! Design Co.</a> in Minneapolis, MN, USA.</div>\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"comments\">Comments ↓</h2>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Tue, 05 Mar 2024 23:55:48 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:10:\"Toby Cryns\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:21;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:84:\"WPTavern: Cwicly’s Unexpected Farewell: Founder Decides to Discontinue Development\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154678\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:91:\"https://wptavern.com/cwiclys-unexpected-farewell-founder-decides-to-discontinue-development\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:7942:\"<p>In a shocking development, the Gutenberg-based page builder <a href=\"https://cwicly.com/\">Cwicly</a>’s founder Louis-Alexander Désiré has announced that the team is discontinuing the Cwicly development “after much deliberation and soul-searching.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Packed with innovative features and a commitment to embracing the WordPress vision in Gutenberg, Cwicly attracted a lot of attention. The community noted their recent tailwind expansion too. According to its description in <a href=\"https://appsumo.com/products/cwicly-builder/\">AppSumo</a>, “Cwicly is the only builder that interacts directly with the whole Gutenberg ecosystem and adds specialized blocks that are complementary and fully compatible with Gutenberg.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>In a <a href=\"https://cwicly.com/\">blog post</a> and email to users, Louis attributed the abrupt decision to&nbsp; “the relentless onslaught of destructive posts and comments by certain WordPress influencers”. He said, “Personal attacks on both myself and team members have been made and openly tolerated throughout. The negativity and hostility directed towards Cwicly, especially in comparison to other page builders, have taken a significant toll on our morale and motivation.”</p>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p>“The passion and dedication that we have had from the start has been gradually diluted, enthusiasm has given way to dread. Working in such a negative climate has taken a significant toll on the team, making it nearly impossible to continue. Each day has become a struggle.”&nbsp;</p>\n</blockquote>\n\n\n\n<p>Louis assured users that Cwicly services will continue until the end of 2024, with reimbursements for all orders made after January 1, 2024.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The statement was later retracted from the website, stating the discontinuation of the plugin development and ensuring user support during the transition period. However, the original statement is still available in <a href=\"https://discourse.cwicly.com/t/discontinuation-of-cwicly-development/5522\">Discourse</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<h1 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Reaction of the Community&nbsp;</h1>\n\n\n\n<p>The WordPress community reacted with surprise and shock, especially considering that new features had been released just days before. “This is the biggest shock I’ve had in the recent past! Had to check if the date was 1st April. I hope Cwicly undo their decision” tweeted WordPress developer <a href=\"https://twitter.com/srikat/status/1764385731563454614\">Sridhar Katakam</a> while <a href=\"https://twitter.com/pootlepress/status/1764340304721727602\">Jamie Marsland</a>, founder of Pootlepress, called the statement released “a very sad statement”.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Several people searched for scathing reviews and tweeted about not finding any devastating reviews or comments against Cwicly while others mentioned seeing negative comments in Facebook groups.&nbsp;<a href=\"https://twitter.com/arniepalmer/status/1764410609867559144\">Andrew Palmer</a>, co-founder of Bertha.AI revealed he has “seen a few comments on YT education videos for Cwicly where commenters say it’s trash.” </p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"https://www.facebook.com/groups/dynamicwordpress/permalink/1456468901975256/\">Sujay Pawar</a>, CEO of Brainstorm Force, posted on Facebook “If you&#8217;re active in Facebook groups, you know how toxic some communities can be with trolls. I&#8217;ve had to take breaks from Facebook for my own mental health. I think Cwicly&#8217;s decision to stop must have been about more than just mean comments from some influencers. It&#8217;s probably about all the challenges of running a WordPress products business, especially the financial aspects, in demotivating communities where people are quick to criticize without realizing there&#8217;s a human being on the other side.”&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"https://www.facebook.com/groups/dynamicwordpress/permalink/1455267252095421/\">David McCan</a>, who had published “<a href=\"https://www.webtng.com/the-cwicly-conundrum/\">The Cwicly Conundrum: Two Years On Is It Ready to Use Yet</a>?” posted “I suspect that my article The Cwicly Conundrum may have contributed to their loss of morale.&nbsp; While as far as I know what I wrote was accurate, I realize that I was expressing my frustrations about feeling it wasn’t ready yet.&nbsp; I’m sorry if this contributed to their loss of morale, and it is a reminder that as a user and reviewer it is important to remember the people behind the product.” He continued “Cwicly is cutting edge and made a good contribution to the WordPress ecosystem.&nbsp; I hope the Cwicly team is able to continue with it, but if they don’t feel they can then I encourage them to keep it going long enough to look for someone who would want to purchase it, so they get some return and the product can live on.”&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"https://twitter.com/wpmodder/status/1764370654332068326\">Adam W. Warner</a>, GoDaddyPro Director Field Marketing, shared, “I’ve never used it, but everything mention I’ve seen of it was positive. Raving fans in fact. Obviously there’s been negative feedback somewhere though. However, as a business owner, it pays to have a thick skin for the naysayers. Easy to say, harder to do.” Justin Ferriman also agreed,&nbsp; “Criticism and entrepreneurship go hand-in-hand (especially in the case of products). Probably just wasn&#8217;t for the founder, and that&#8217;s okay. It&#8217;s stressful.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>WordPress Tampa Bay organizer <a href=\"https://twitter.com/schutzsmith/status/1764363078689264076\">Daniel AwesomeSmith</a> hoped “they’re not blaming community when it’s just business acumen and product fit to blame the most.” <a href=\"https://twitter.com/thekevingeary/status/1764363817901834463\">Kevin Geary</a>, WordPress entrepreneur, clarified that he “spent the last 3-5 months telling everyone that Cwicly is the 2nd best page builder for WordPress.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Co-founder of Newsletter Glue, <a href=\"https://twitter.com/lesley_pizza/status/1764477373263819040\">Lesley Sim</a> tweeted, “I don&#8217;t think shutting down is the right answer, I think levelling up as a business owner is. But, you can&#8217;t really teach that. They just have to decide to do it.” <a href=\"https://twitter.com/alexjvasquez/status/1764426557412737220\">Alex Vasquez</a> of DigiSavvy “wouldn&#8217;t be surprised if the owner/dev reverses course on their decision to shutter @cwicly. I find it beyond wild to just abandon your customers like that.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“Consider rebranding Cwicly instead of shutting it down &#8211; a fresh start can help overcome negativity and attract a more positive audience.” recommended entrepreneur <a href=\"https://twitter.com/mahdiali_/status/1764641586330370386\">MahdiAli Khanusiya</a>. “Some of the big guys like @automattic, @LiquidWeb, @syedbalkhi should check out @cwicly. Could be an acquisition / buy out. There&#8217;s a lot of great features there that could end up in core, or at least shouldn&#8217;t be thrown out.” proposed WPAI founder <a href=\"https://twitter.com/jameswlepage/status/1764532987507421294\">James LePage</a>.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I have reached out to Louis and am still waiting to hear back from him. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Update:</strong> Louis-Alexander Désiré has issued an update on <a href=\"https://discourse.cwicly.com/t/the-future-of-cwicly/5536\">Cwicly&#8217;s Discourse site</a> about their future plans. They have reimbursed the new subscribers and will provide support to all users till 2024. From 2025 onwards, they will offer maintenance plans at discounted rates for those who wish to continue to benefit from Cwicly updates but no new features will be introduced. More details will be shared later. Lifetime holders can continue to enjoy maintenance benefits and access the Cwicly plugin at no extra cost.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Tue, 05 Mar 2024 18:23:21 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:7:\"Jyolsna\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:22;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:53:\"WordPress.org blog: WordPress 6.5 Release Candidate 1\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:35:\"https://wordpress.org/news/?p=17008\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:69:\"https://wordpress.org/news/2024/03/wordpress-6-5-release-candidate-1/\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:10939:\"<p>The first release candidate (RC1) for WordPress 6.5 is ready for download and testing!</p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>This version of the WordPress software is under development</strong>.<strong> Please do not install, run, or test this version of WordPress on production or mission-critical websites.</strong> Instead, it’s recommended that you evaluate RC1 on a test server and site.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Reaching this phase of the release cycle is an important milestone. While release candidates are considered ready for release, testing remains crucial to ensure that everything in WordPress 6.5 is the best it can be.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>You can test WordPress 6.5 RC1 in four ways:</p>\n\n\n\n<table><tbody><tr><th>Plugin</th><td>Install and activate the <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/plugins/wordpress-beta-tester/\">WordPress Beta Tester</a> plugin on a WordPress install. (Select the “Bleeding edge” channel and “Beta/RC Only” stream).</td></tr><tr><th>Direct Download</th><td>Download the <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/wordpress-6.5-RC1.zip\">RC1 version (zip)</a> and install it on a WordPress website.</td></tr><tr><th>Command Line</th><td>Use the following <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/cli/\">WP-CLI</a> command:<br /><code>wp core update --version=6.5-RC1</code></td></tr><tr><th>WordPress Playground</th><td>Use the <a href=\"https://playground.wordpress.net/#%7B%20%22preferredVersions%22:%20%7B%20%22php%22:%20%228.0%22,%20%22wp%22:%20%22beta%22%20%7D,%20%22features%22:%20%7B%20%22networking%22:%20true%20%7D,%20%22steps%22:%20[%20%7B%20%22step%22:%20%22login%22,%20%22username%22:%20%22admin%22,%20%22password%22:%20%22password%22%20%7D,%20%7B%20%22step%22:%20%22importFile%22,%20%22file%22:%20%7B%20%22resource%22:%20%22url%22,%20%22url%22:%20%22https://raw.githubusercontent.com/wpaccessibility/a11y-theme-unit-test/master/a11y-theme-unit-test-data.xml%22%20%7D%20%7D,%20%7B%20%22step%22:%20%22importFile%22,%20%22file%22:%20%7B%20%22resource%22:%20%22url%22,%20%22url%22:%20%22https://raw.githubusercontent.com/WordPress/theme-test-data/master/themeunittestdata.wordpress.xml%22%20%7D%20%7D,%20%7B%20%22step%22:%20%22installPlugin%22,%20%22pluginZipFile%22:%20%7B%20%22resource%22:%20%22wordpress.org/plugins%22,%20%22slug%22:%20%22query-monitor%22%20%7D,%20%22options%22:%20%7B%20%22activate%22:%20false%20%7D,%20%22progress%22:%20%7B%20%22weight%22:%202%20%7D%20%7D,%20%7B%20%22step%22:%20%22installPlugin%22,%20%22pluginZipFile%22:%20%7B%20%22resource%22:%20%22wordpress.org/plugins%22,%20%22slug%22:%20%22create-block-theme%22%20%7D,%20%22progress%22:%20%7B%20%22weight%22:%202%20%7D%20%7D,%20%7B%20%22step%22:%20%22installPlugin%22,%20%22pluginZipFile%22:%20%7B%20%22resource%22:%20%22wordpress.org/plugins%22,%20%22slug%22:%20%22debug-bar%22%20%7D,%20%22progress%22:%20%7B%20%22weight%22:%202%20%7D%20%7D,%20%7B%20%22step%22:%20%22installPlugin%22,%20%22pluginZipFile%22:%20%7B%20%22resource%22:%20%22wordpress.org/plugins%22,%20%22slug%22:%20%22health-check%22%20%7D,%20%22progress%22:%20%7B%20%22weight%22:%202%20%7D%20%7D,%20%7B%20%22step%22:%20%22installPlugin%22,%20%22pluginZipFile%22:%20%7B%20%22resource%22:%20%22wordpress.org/plugins%22,%20%22slug%22:%20%22test-reports%22%20%7D,%20%22progress%22:%20%7B%20%22weight%22:%202%20%7D%20%7D,%20%7B%20%22step%22:%20%22installPlugin%22,%20%22pluginZipFile%22:%20%7B%20%22resource%22:%20%22wordpress.org/plugins%22,%20%22slug%22:%20%22user-switching%22%20%7D,%20%22progress%22:%20%7B%20%22weight%22:%202%20%7D%20%7D%20]%20%7D\">6.5 RC1 WordPress Playground instance</a> (available within 35 minutes after the release is ready) to test the software directly in your browser without the need for a separate site or setup.</td></tr></tbody></table>\n\n\n\n<p>The current target for the WordPress 6.5 release is <strong>March 26, 2024</strong>. Get an overview of the <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/6-5/\">6.5 release cycle</a>, and check the <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/\">Make WordPress Core blog</a> for <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/tag/6-5/\">6.5-related posts</a> in the coming weeks for further details.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">What&#8217;s in WordPress 6.5 RC1?</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Thanks to the many contributors testing up to this point, this release includes more than 20 bug fixes for the Editor and more than 40 <a href=\"https://core.trac.wordpress.org/query?status=closed&changetime=02%2F27%2F2024..03%2F05%2F2024&milestone=6.5&col=id&col=milestone&col=owner&col=type&col=priority&order=id\">tickets for WordPress Core</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Get a recap of WordPress 6.5’s highlighted features in the <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/news/2024/02/wordpress-6-5-beta-1/\">Beta 1 announcement</a>. For more technical information related to issues addressed since Beta 3, you can browse the following links:</p>\n\n\n\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https://github.com/WordPress/gutenberg/commits/wp/6.5?since=2024-02-27&until=2024-03-05\">GitHub commits for 6.5</a> since February 27</li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://core.trac.wordpress.org/query?status=closed&changetime=02%2F27%2F2024..03%2F05%2F2024&milestone=6.5&col=id&col=milestone&col=owner&col=type&col=priority&order=id\">Closed Trac tickets</a> since February 27</li>\n</ul>\n\n\n\n<p>Want to look deeper into the details and technical notes for this release? These recent posts cover some of the latest updates:</p>\n\n\n\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2024/03/05/introducing-plugin-dependencies-in-wordpress-6-5/\">Introducing Plugin Dependencies in WordPress 6.5</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2024/03/05/unification-of-the-site-and-post-editors-in-6-5/\">Unification of the Site and Post Editors in 6.5</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2024/03/04/updates-to-the-html-api-in-6-5/\">Updates to the HTML API in 6.5</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2024/03/04/interactivity-api-dev-note/\">Interactivity API in 6.5</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2024/02/27/i18n-improvements-6-5-performant-translations/\">I18N Improvements in 6.5 (Performant Translations)</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2024/02/23/wordpress-6-5-adds-avif-support/\">WordPress 6.5 adds AVIF support</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2024/02/10/core-editor-improvement-power-in-the-details/\">Core Editor Improvement: Power in the Details</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2024/01/22/core-editor-improvement-robust-revisions-in-the-site-editor/\">Core Editor Improvement: Robust Revisions in the Site Editor</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/tag/dev-notes-6-5/\">All 6.5-related developer notes</a></li>\n</ul>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">How you can contribute</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>WordPress is open source software made possible by a passionate community of people collaborating on and contributing to its development. The resources below outline various ways you can help the world’s most popular open source web platform, regardless of your technical expertise.</p>\n\n\n\n<h3 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Get involved in testing</h3>\n\n\n\n<p>Testing for issues is critical to ensuring WordPress is performant and stable. It’s also a meaningful way for anyone to contribute. <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/test/2024/02/28/help-test-wordpress-beta-3/\">This detailed guide</a> will walk you through testing features in WordPress 6.5. For those new to testing, follow <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/test/2024/02/15/help-test-wordpress-6-5-beta-1\">this general testing guide</a> for more details on getting set up.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>If you encounter an issue, please report it to the <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/support/forum/alphabeta/\">Alpha/Beta area</a> of the support forums or directly to <a href=\"https://core.trac.wordpress.org/newticket\">WordPress Trac</a> if you are comfortable writing a reproducible bug report. You can also check your issue against a list of <a href=\"https://core.trac.wordpress.org/tickets/major\">known bugs</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Curious about testing releases in general? Follow along with the <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/test/\">testing initiatives in Make Core</a> and join the <a href=\"https://wordpress.slack.com/messages/core-test/\">#core-test channel</a> on <a href=\"https://wordpress.slack.com/\">Making WordPress Slack</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<h3 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Search for vulnerabilities</h3>\n\n\n\n<p>From now until the final release candidate of WordPress 6.5 (scheduled for March 19), the <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/security/2024/02/12/welcoming-2024-with-wordpress-6-5-beta-1/\">monetary reward for reporting new, unreleased security vulnerabilities</a> is doubled. Please follow responsible disclosure practices as detailed in the project’s security practices and policies outlined on the <a href=\"https://hackerone.com/wordpress\">HackerOne page</a> and in the <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/about/security/\">security white paper</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<h3 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Update your theme or plugin</h3>\n\n\n\n<p>For plugin and theme authors, your products play an integral role in extending the functionality and value of WordPress for all users.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Thanks for continuing to test your themes and plugins with the WordPress 6.5 beta releases. With RC1, you’ll want to conclude your testing and update the <em>“Tested up to”</em> version in your <a href=\"https://developer.wordpress.org/plugins/wordpress-org/how-your-readme-txt-works/\">plugin’s readme file</a> to 6.5.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>If you find compatibility issues, please post detailed information to the <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/support/forum/alphabeta/\">support forum</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<h3 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Help translate WordPress</h3>\n\n\n\n<p>Do you speak a language other than English? ¿Español? Français? Русский? 日本? हिन्दी? বাংলা? You can <a href=\"https://translate.wordpress.org/projects/wp/dev/\">help translate WordPress into more than 100 languages</a>. This release milestone (RC1) also marks the <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/polyglots/handbook/glossary/#hard-freeze\">hard string freeze</a> point of the 6.5 release cycle.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Release the haiku</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>What’s this? RC1?<br />Three weeks left until it’s done.<br />Come and test. It’s fun!</p>\n\n\n\n<p><em>Thank you to the following contributors for collaborating on this post: <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/dansoschin/\" class=\"mention\"><span class=\"mentions-prefix\">@</span>dansoschin</a>,</em> <em><a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/courane01/\" class=\"mention\"><span class=\"mentions-prefix\">@</span>courane01</a>, <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/hellosatya/\" class=\"mention\"><span class=\"mentions-prefix\">@</span>hellosatya</a>, <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/huzaifaalmesbah/\" class=\"mention\"><span class=\"mentions-prefix\">@</span>huzaifaalmesbah</a></em></p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Tue, 05 Mar 2024 16:26:05 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:12:\"Lauren Stein\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:23;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:116:\"WPTavern: Gutenberg’s Project Leadership Sits Down with  Outreach Program to Discuss Problems with the Site Editor\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154655\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:124:\"https://wptavern.com/gutenbergs-project-leadership-sits-down-with-new-outreach-team-to-discuss-problems-with-the-site-editor\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:17507:\"<p><em>What do you get when you put a handful of outspoken WordPress developers, agencies, product owners, and community advocates on a video call with the Lead Architect and Product Managers of the entire Gutenberg project? Hopefully progress.</em></p>\n\n\n\n<p>Matt Mullenweg may have surprised a few people when <a href=\"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e92_Wo-bIng\">he recently stated</a> that the Gutenberg project still has <em>years</em> of development to go, but I doubt that anyone using it would disagree. The tentpole feature of Gutenberg&#8217;s Phase Two, the &#8220;Site Editor,&#8221; has been in core (and enabled by default for new installations) for the last two years, but the adoption of block-based themes has <a href=\"https://twitter.com/hluehrsen/status/1759881773461168600\">felt underwhelming at best</a>, especially compared to the <a href=\"https://w3techs.com/technologies/details/cm-elementor\">market share of page-building tools like Elementor</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Everyone has their opinions of the block editor, one need only browse the comments section of this very site to find them. The reality however is that WordPress is a vast and complicated project. While it&#8217;s certainly subject to the decisions of its &#8220;Benevolent Dictator&#8221;, it is also subject to the very real constraints of large-scale, distributed, open-source software development. Not to mention the work is entirely based on contributions, many of which are sponsored by large organizations with their own goals for the project.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>At the center of all of this are the individual WordPress end users who can feel like they have no agency in the project, no ability to communicate their experiences or give feedback. And there may be no piece of software in more critical need of user feedback than the WordPress Site Editor.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">The Outreach Experiment<sup class=\"fn\"><a href=\"https://wptavern.com/feed#76dd9696-f1d1-4d83-825d-d5e6dbe973b7\" id=\"76dd9696-f1d1-4d83-825d-d5e6dbe973b7-link\">1</a></sup> </h2>\n\n\n\n<p>The FSE Outreach Experiment <a href=\"https://wptavern.com/help-steer-the-future-of-wordpress-via-the-fse-outreach-program\">was launched three years ago</a> as a way to bridge that gap between users experiencing the Site Editor and the core contributors building it. Last week, the <a href=\"https://wptavern.com/fse-outreach-experimental-loses-two-words-gains-new-life\">program announced a simplified name and scope</a>: Outreach. As part of this new simplified scope, any core contributor can now tag Outreach directly in GitHub as they develop new features when they want early feedback from the broader community. The goal is getting more two-way communication happening, and keeping the feedback where it can be most effective: the <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/chat/\">Make WordPress Slack</a> and the <a href=\"https://github.com/wordPress/gutenberg\">Gutenberg</a> code repository on GitHub.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Social media may feel like the easiest place to voice an opinion (something I am certainly guilty of), but it doesn&#8217;t always manifest into meaningful change. &#8220;Most of our issues are around just discoverability,&#8221; Developer Advocate and Outreach member Justin Tadlock <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2024/02/23/recap-hallway-hangout-whats-next-for-the-outreach-program/\">pointed out recently</a>. &#8220;Just getting people to come and take all their reactions and thoughts from social media and bring it in and have some constructive conversations in an official channel.&#8221;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Automattic Product Wrangler Anne McCarthy has served as the Editor Triage Lead for the last handful of WordPress Core releases and led the original FSE Outreach Experiment. They recently collected some of this feedback on the Site Editor in the form of a widely circulated blog post, &#8220;<a href=\"https://nomad.blog/2024/02/16/overlapping-problems/\">Overlapping problems</a>&#8220;. It&#8217;s a breakdown of some of the most common user experience complaints, but nearly every piece of feedback links to a specific issue or pull request where work is being done to improve it. If you haven&#8217;t already, I recommend pausing now to read it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Because the problems are &#8220;overlapping&#8221;, some feel that they speak to an underlying problem with the Site Editor itself and the Gutenberg development process more broadly. Many armchair theories were thrown out, including some from yours truly, at last week&#8217;s <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2024/02/27/summary-of-hallway-hangout-on-overlapping-problems-in-the-site-editor/\">Hallway Hangout</a>, hosted by the Anne McCarthy, and attended by a wide array of other leaders, including Gutenberg&#8217;s Lead Architect, Matias Ventura and Product Manager, Rich Tabor.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Is the Core Team listening?</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Feedback loops in a community this large and diverse are (un)surprisingly hard to get right. One clear piece of feedback, though, seems to be a general feeling that while the Site Editor&#8217;s power and feature-set continue to grow, the actual user experience needs more polish. Yet when concerns about this user experience are raised, the general response is that it’s the users who just need more education and training.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>&#8220;There&#8217;s a sentiment that I kept seeing,&#8221; Mike McAlister of <a href=\"https://olliewp.com/\">Ollie</a> explained on the call, &#8220;that &#8216;they&#8217;re not listening to us&#8217;. And whether that&#8217;s perception or their experience or whatever, I think that is very important for us to carry that and to kind of acknowledge it.”&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Part of the disconnect between the different sides of our large community is related to that imbalance of incentives amongst contributors. Unless you are employed by a hosting company or a product team like WooCommerce or Yoast, it may feel discouraging to push a feature forward or feel like no one is advocating for your use case.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>WordPress is meant to democratize the ability to put content on the internet. So there&#8217;s an expectation that its interface should feel, well, easier or at least more intuitive. Nick Diego, Developer Advocate from Automattic, shared an experience of watching his non-technical parents navigate the Site Editor.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>&#8220;One of the biggest issues I see in the Site Editor,&#8221; he explained, &#8220;is around how changes that you make are preserved to prevent people from making mistakes. And this seems like such a small little thing, but I watched [my dad] delete a template that had been customized and there was no way to get it back easily. I watched him click on &#8216;Clear Customizations&#8217; and everything was gone. And he was like, wait, what, what&#8217;s happening?&#8221;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Nick was showcasing a great practical example of the types of gaps in the user experience that eventually erode their trust in the platform’s ability to safely manage content. He also pointed out that there are tried and true conventions for many of these interactions. &#8220;In old WordPress, when you trash the page, it goes into the trash and then you can delete it permanently, right? It goes into your trash. Oh, I made a mistake? I can bring that back. It&#8217;s a very logical flow. It&#8217;s very similar to other applications.&#8221; But the Site Editor often veers into uncharted territory when it comes to user interface.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>New tools and new paradigms aren&#8217;t just hard for the non-technical users. They can present new challenges for the developers who are trying to launch new WordPress sites. Time that developers previously spent building websites is now often spent exploring new potential workflows, and we can&#8217;t rely on our previous two decades of established best practices when scoping new projects. &#8220;I think part of this too,&#8221; said Anne McCarthy, &#8220;is also how to use these tools and changing process because everything I&#8217;ve heard is it&#8217;s not only a technical change and adjusting to new technology, but it&#8217;s changing process.&#8221;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>This idea of slowing down and refining the basic user experience was reiterated by Brian Gardner, Developer Advocate at WP Engine, who advocated &#8220;a call to rally around making what we have already better and consistent and easy to identify and work and document and educate.&#8221; WP Engine in particular has leaned into the developer/freelancer side of the community, with a team of educators and content creators, and products like <a href=\"https://www.advancedcustomfields.com/\">Advanced Custom Fields</a> and <a href=\"https://localwp.com/\">LocalWP</a>, all focused on a segment of the market they call &#8220;<a href=\"https://wpengine.com/builders/\">Builders</a>&#8221; and what the Core Team often refers to as &#8220;extenders&#8221;.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">The Extenders<sup class=\"fn\"><a href=\"https://wptavern.com/feed#0d40de72-2166-4c3e-a55b-82e973a8f179\" id=\"0d40de72-2166-4c3e-a55b-82e973a8f179-link\">2</a></sup></h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Extenders, builders, developers, freelancers, agencies. There&#8217;s plenty of names for this side of the community, but the one thing they have in common is that they build a lot of websites, often for other, less-technical people. There&#8217;s widespread sentiment in this group that the Gutenberg&nbsp; project is not prioritizing their needs, driving them to the <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/plugins/classic-editor/\">Classic Editor</a> or page builders like Elementor, Divi, and Bricks.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Fabian Kägy is a member of the Outreach program and a sponsored contributor from the agency <a href=\"https://10up.com/\">10up</a>. He&#8217;s focused on fostering more conversation between the extender community and core development, so I spoke to him about this disconnect in priorities.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>&#8220;There are so many different users that have all different calls&#8221;, he told me. &#8220;And kind of the reason why I am trying to participate is to share that one side of the story and be an advocate for that particular work. And I am very much hoping that I can actually get more similar folks from other agencies to also chime in and be a part of a conversation.&#8221;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Like Fabian, I come from the agency world, where we are constantly stuck trying to balance the desire to adopt the newest technologies for our clients with the need for assurance that those new features are actually ready to be used in production. That presents a tough problem to solve. The core team needs more people using and testing these features, to help refine them. But from the outside perspective, we&#8217;re hesitant to use anything that may not be production-ready.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>&#8220;At the time a feature lands in WordPress Core,&#8221; Fabian explained, &#8220;there could be four or five months since the developer had originally worked on the feature. Since they last even thought about the feature, they&#8217;ve moved on and shipped three other features. And so that feedback cycle from the agency space is incredibly slow because by the time we adopt it, that is not top of mind anymore.&#8221;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>This gap between the development of a new feature and its adoption by the wider community is the main problem the Outreach program is hoping to solve.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>&#8220;That is why I am hoping that this kind of outreach,&#8221; he continued, &#8220;getting more pings, getting asked the question of &#8216;Hey, is this the right thing?&#8217; Being asked to provide feedback earlier in kind of the development cycle should help us be able to deliver that feedback earlier in the cycle so that we don&#8217;t end up in the situation where a year after the feature has been developed, we all of a sudden say, &#8220;Hey, but this didn&#8217;t account for these issues that we are running into.&#8221;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>If airing your Gutenberg grievances on social media is unhelpful, raising them six months after a feature was originally developed and tested might even be less so. But with the huge array of features being worked on (there are over 1,000 open pull requests just in the Gutenberg repository), some on a timescale of years, WordPress needs the Outreach program&#8217;s ability to do some human curation, often in the form of &#8220;Hallway Hangouts&#8221; where new features are showcased and discussed.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">We are the world, we are the contributors</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Watch any meeting of the Outreach program, and you&#8217;ll quickly realize that everyone, including a number of Automattic-sponsored contributors, often appear just as &#8220;in the dark&#8221; as we do. They have many of the same struggles we have. The difference is, they are trying to build a space where we can all connect the dots together. It was a great reminder that we&#8217;re all contributors here. WordPress isn&#8217;t <em>some people over there building a thing</em>, it&#8217;s just <a href=\"https://wordpress.tv/2023/10/02/we-are-they-fostering-belonging-as-a-wordpress-contributor/\">a whole lot of us</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>One of those people is Matias Ventura, considered by many the de facto lead of the Gutenberg project. Matias joined this most recent Hallway Hangout, listening to feedback and sharing his initial impressions. After hearing from a number of voices asking about some of the features in Gutenberg that still need polish, he was quick to clarify that there is still work to be done and conversations that need to happen.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>&#8220;I think part of that,&#8221; he explained, &#8220;is also how we communicate, how we do the marketing, both internally to know the roadmap where we&#8217;re heading, but also if you have this specific use case, what are the things that you should keep in mind? Because there&#8217;s a lot of things to absorb and configure them properly and so forth.&#8221;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>For many, this response hints at one of the core issues we face with the Site Editor: understanding when a problem is a lack of education or an actual lack in functionality.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Matias clarified his thoughts, &#8220;I think that depending on the use cases, I would say yeah, the Site Editor is absolutely ready for some of those. For some others, I think like, yeah, you might not have all the right tools, or you might need to reach out to other plugins in the ecosystem to fill in the gaps.&#8221;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Over a year ago, the WordPress project <a href=\"https://wptavern.com/wordpress-6-3-development-kicks-off-to-conclude-gutenberg-phase-2\">announced the transition</a> from Phase 2 (Customization) to Phase 3 (Collaboration), sparking concern that the Site Editor was going to be left not fully realized. What this Hallway Hangout made clear was that the Core Team is still very dedicated to working on these overlapping issues with the Site Editor.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>They&#8217;re going to need all the help they can get, and the Outreach contributors certainly has their work cut out for them.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>&#8220;I think the easiest way to get involved,&#8221; Fabian told me, &#8220;is to raise your hand and say, &#8216;Hey, I want to become a part of this team on GitHub&#8217; so that you then receive those notifications in your inbox about features that are looking for more feedback. And then from there you can, at your own leisure, at whatever amount of time you have to dedicate it to open source, take a look at just the titles of those pull requests or read through the quick description if you have at that time.&#8221;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>If you&#8217;re in the weeds of building WordPress websites and implementing new Block and Site Editor features, it can be hard to find the time to give feedback. I certainly have the tendency to go straight to social media when I’m struggling with a lack of functionality or an irritating choice in the user interface. That said, I’m invested in the future of WordPress as a platform, so I’m joining the <a href=\"https://wordpress.slack.com/archives/C015GUFFC00\">#outreach</a> channel in Slack and trying to provide feedback whenever I can.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>While we may not immediately resolve these overlapping problems in the overall experience, the fact that there are core contributors willing to talk openly about the Site Editor’s shortcomings is a sign of progress towards a goal I think we can all agree on: the continued success of the WordPress project.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><em>Update: This article was modified Tuesday, March 5 to better clarify the roles of various contributors and the Outreach program more broadly.</em></p>\n\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-spacer\"></div>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-text-color has-neutral-500-color has-alpha-channel-opacity has-neutral-500-background-color has-background is-style-wide\" />\n\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-spacer\"></div>\n\n\n<ol class=\"wp-block-footnotes\"><li id=\"76dd9696-f1d1-4d83-825d-d5e6dbe973b7\">Sounds like a great band name <a href=\"https://wptavern.com/feed#76dd9696-f1d1-4d83-825d-d5e6dbe973b7-link\"><img src=\"https://s.w.org/images/core/emoji/14.0.0/72x72/21a9.png\" alt=\"↩\" class=\"wp-smiley\" />︎</a></li><li id=\"0d40de72-2166-4c3e-a55b-82e973a8f179\">Also sounds like a great band name <a href=\"https://wptavern.com/feed#0d40de72-2166-4c3e-a55b-82e973a8f179-link\"><img src=\"https://s.w.org/images/core/emoji/14.0.0/72x72/21a9.png\" alt=\"↩\" class=\"wp-smiley\" />︎</a></li></ol>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Mon, 04 Mar 2024 21:51:08 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:12:\"Brian Coords\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:24;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:67:\"WordPress.org blog: WordCamp Asia 2024: Q&amp;A with Matt Mullenweg\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:35:\"https://wordpress.org/news/?p=17015\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:77:\"https://wordpress.org/news/2024/03/wordcamp-asia-2024-qa-with-matt-mullenweg/\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:2412:\"<img width=\"1024\" height=\"299\" src=\"https://i0.wp.com/wordpress.org/news/files/2024/03/wcasia-logo.png?resize=1024%2C299&ssl=1\" alt=\"WordCamp Asia 2024\" class=\"wp-image-17016\" />\n\n\n\n<p>WordCamp Asia 2024 is just a few days away—starting on March 7 in Taipei, Taiwan. This unique three-day summit will feature a distinguished lineup of speakers, numerous networking opportunities, and a closing Q&amp;A experience with WordPress co-founder Matt Mullenweg. The live Q&amp;A session will be streamed for WordPress enthusiasts worldwide, beginning at 3:30 p.m. Taipei Standard Time (7:30 a.m. UTC) on Saturday, March 9, 2024.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Watch the event live stream on the <a href=\"https://youtube.com/wordpress\">WordPress YouTube channel</a> or visit the <a href=\"https://asia.wordcamp.org/2024/\">event website</a> for more details.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>What:</strong> Q&amp;A Session with Matt Mullenweg<br /><strong>When: </strong>March 9, 2024 at 7:30 a.m. UTC (Start of live stream)<br /><strong>Where: </strong><a href=\"https://asia.wordcamp.org/2024/location/\">Taipei International Convention Center<br /></a><strong>Streaming: </strong><a href=\"https://youtube.com/wordpress\">Watch the live stream</a> on the WordPress YouTube channel.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Have a question for Matt?</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>If you want to participate, please submit your question via Slido from March 7 until about 6:00 a.m. UTC on Friday, March 8. <em>Slido is now closed.</em></p>\n\n\n\n<p>Given the expected volume of submitted questions, only some will be answered live, while others will be covered in a follow-up post published after the event on <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/project\">make.wordpress.org/project</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>See you in-person and online on March 7!</p>\n\n\n\n<p>谢谢!</p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity\" />\n\n\n\n<p><em>Thank you to <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/rmartinezduque/\" class=\"mention\"><span class=\"mentions-prefix\">@</span>rmartinezduque</a>, <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/eidolonnight/\" class=\"mention\"><span class=\"mentions-prefix\">@</span>eidolonnight</a>, <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/cbringmann/\" class=\"mention\"><span class=\"mentions-prefix\">@</span>cbringmann</a>, and <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/bjmcsherry/\" class=\"mention\"><span class=\"mentions-prefix\">@</span>bjmcsherry</a> for reviewing this post.</em></p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Mon, 04 Mar 2024 15:50:16 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:11:\"Dan Soschin\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:25;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:93:\"WordPress.org blog: WP Briefing: Episode 74: Kickstart (Or Level-Up) Your Contributor Journey\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:53:\"https://wordpress.org/news/?post_type=podcast&p=17007\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:93:\"https://wordpress.org/news/2024/03/episode-74-kickstart-or-level-up-your-contributor-journey/\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:12317:\"<p>Explore the impact you can make on WordPress without coding in this WordPress Briefing episode hosted by Executive Director Josepha Haden Chomphosy. She&#8217;ll guide you through diverse non-coding contributions suitable for all skill levels, including content translation, photo submissions, event organization, and software testing. Listen and discover how you can enhance the WordPress community in ways that align with your interests and expertise.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Credits</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Host: <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/chanthaboune/\">Josepha Haden Chomphosy</a><br />Editor: <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/dustinhartzler/\">Dustin Hartzler</a><br />Logo: <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/javiarce/\">Javier Arce</a><br />Production: <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/bjmcsherry/\">Brett McSherry</a>, <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/cbringmann/\">Chloé Bringmann</a><br />Song: Fearless First by Kevin MacLeod</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Show Notes</h2>\n\n\n\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https://asia.wordcamp.org/2024/\">WordCamp Asia 2024</a>\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https://asia.wordcamp.org/2024/contributor-day/\">Contributor Day</a></li>\n</ul>\n</li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://wordpress.org/photos/\">WordPress Photo Directory</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/polyglots/\">Polyglots</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://wordpress.org/support/forums/\">WordPress Support Forums</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://events.wordpress.org/\">Upcoming WordPress Events</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/test/\">Make WordPress Testing</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://learn.wordpress.org/\">Learn WordPress</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><strong>Small List of Big Things</strong>\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https://wordpress.org/news/2024/02/2023-annual-survey-results-and-next-steps/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noreferrer noopener\">2023 Annual Survey Results and Next Steps</a>&nbsp; </li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/community/2024/01/22/proposal-pilot-program-to-test-gatherpress-on-the-wordpress-org-network-as-a-meetup-alternative/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noreferrer noopener\">Gather Press Pilot Program</a>&nbsp;</li>\n</ul>\n</li>\n</ul>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Transcripts</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:00:00]&nbsp;<strong>Josepha:</strong>&nbsp;Hello, everyone, and welcome to the WordPress Briefing, the podcast where you can catch quick explanations of the ideas behind the WordPress open source project, some insight into the community that supports it, and get a small list of big things coming up in the next two weeks. I&#8217;m your host, Josepha Haden Chomphosy. Here we go.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:00:29] (Intro music)&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:00:40]&nbsp;<strong>Josepha:</strong> At the end of this week, WordCamp Asia is happening. It&#8217;s one of our largest events dedicated to WordPress, and it will cover a wide range of topics. From advanced concepts like running thriving businesses to more beginner things like building your first theme, there is bound to be something for you at this event.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>For folks who have the opportunity to attend in person, you might also be going to your first-ever Contributor Day. Now, as much as I want there to be something for everyone there, I recognize that it&#8217;s a little more frenetic than your average WordPress event. It&#8217;s not any less welcoming than the event that has like a schedule and, tracks, and rooms.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:01:19] <strong>Josepha:</strong> But in my experience of any group of open source contributors, they get really excited when they are tackling problems together. And that&#8217;s most of what happens at a Contributor Day. It can make it a little difficult to see how you can join in. But never fear; the crew at the WordPress Briefing has you covered. We&#8217;ve got a couple of ways you can contribute immediately, no code required, and a handful of good next steps when you&#8217;re feeling comfortable and ready to level up.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>For total beginners, so you&#8217;ve got a WordPress site, or you know, you&#8217;re about to launch one. And you&#8217;re here to learn and meet people and hopefully find someone who answers the questions you feel too shy to mention in public.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So these two ways of contribution are for you. First, you can contribute photos. WordPress has a photo directory for openly licensed photos, which are included in Openverse searches. Users can submit photographs to be used by folks all over the world. There are some basic guidelines, such as no faces or identifying characteristics. It can&#8217;t be overly edited or processed, but even photos taken on a smartphone are accepted. Because we understand that the best camera is the one you have on you.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:02:30] <strong>Josepha</strong>: You can also contribute translations. If you speak a language other than English, you can visit <code>translate.WordPress.org</code> and help translate not only the WordPress software but also plugins, themes, and other parts of the WordPress project into your native language. Since more than half of all WordPress installations are in non-English languages, adding or improving translations is really impactful. We are actually at WordCamp Asia trialing a new self-serve translation day process. So that&#8217;s a great place to have a double impact.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:03:03] <strong>Josepha:</strong> So those are your two completely code-free ways that you can contribute, completely beginner friendly ways to contribute at Contributor Day coming up later this week. And then for your next steps, so say that you&#8217;ve had your site for a while, you are an absolute expert in the admin, you&#8217;ve had to answer a few tough questions for yourself, you&#8217;ve watched a lot of tutorials, and so now you&#8217;re thinking of ways you can share that knowledge.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:03:29] <strong>Josepha:</strong> Here are a few ways that you can exercise your new knowledge and really solidify it in your brain. </p>\n\n\n\n<p>Firstly, you can contribute help. Supporting other WordPress users is a great way to give back to WordPress. This can involve answering questions, providing guidance, or even providing the right resources to users. You can check out the WordPress support forums for more information, and they actually have a dedicated support team as well that works toward making sure that WordPress users have answers to the questions they are asking. You can head over to WordPress.org/support/forums and just pick an appropriate area for you, something that you are currently an expert in, and start answering questions. Start contributing.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:04:10] <strong>Josepha:</strong> Second thing you can do is you can contribute patterns. So WordPress has a dedicated Patterns directory, which stores a list of Block patterns. So custom designs that were created using blocks in Gutenberg that then can be used across any WordPress site, anyone&#8217;s WordPress site. You can submit those patterns, any pattern that you built, to the directory, and then they can be used by people all around the world. Basically, like anything with WordPress, if you put it in there, it can be used by anyone all around the world.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The third thing is that you can contribute events. This is one of my favorite ways to contribute. Organizing in person events to an extent has no code requirement to it, but also it does kind of require that you have a good understanding of your local community and have a willingness to get out there and build your network.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>WordPress is where it is today thanks to its excellent community and all the lovely in-person events that happen all over the world. They bring our community together, and anyone can contribute by helping to organize just a small gathering or support an in-person event.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:05:13] <strong>Josepha:</strong> The fourth way that you can level up your contributions is to contribute by breaking things. I know that sounds weird, but testing the software to see where it breaks is actually a really valuable contribution. It&#8217;s as easy as downloading the WordPress beta tester plugin and the test reports plugin to a WordPress installation, Preferably a testing one, not one that&#8217;s currently publicly in use. But you can test out the newest version of WordPress before the release and provide useful feedback to the development team.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And the fifth way that you can level up your contribution is to contribute learning. Not that you are learning as a contribution, but what one person can learn through a tutorial or documentation, another person has to learn through discussion and hands-on learning.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>This team, the folks over at <code>learn.WordPress.org</code>, they are the official team and official learning platform and resource for WordPress. They host video tutorials. Yes, but also host live online workshops, courses and even provide lesson plans on different topics related to WordPress. So if you are an educator or otherwise really like to help spread knowledge around, pass around the knowledge that has been hard-earned by you, this is an excellent opportunity.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:06:28] <strong>Josepha:</strong> And of course, if you are brave and afraid of nothing, then you can just go to Contributor Day and move from table to table until something sounds interesting to you. You don&#8217;t have to have a plan. Your whole plan can absolutely be to wander until you are found.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:06:45] (Music interlude)&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:06:52] <strong>Josepha:</strong> That brings us now to our small list of big things. It&#8217;s actually a very small list today. I&#8217;ve got two things on it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:07:00] <strong>Josepha:</strong> The first is that a couple of weeks back, we published the results from the 2023 annual survey. So, each year, we collect some high-level data about trends and themes across this vast ecosystem of users and site builders, people who extend WordPress core, and contributors who build WordPress core to help inform decision-making and provide valuable feedback on the project status. I looked at the results from our last survey. We had a bit of an increase in the respondents, not as much as we would have liked, but still a little bit greater number than we had in the past couple of years. And I have a lot of questions myself about what we are doing compared to what we are being asked to do and so go take a look at the blog post that has some highlights from it. It&#8217;s got a couple of contextual pieces of information in there as well, and come with your questions to WordCamps around the world or ask them in community meetings as you find them.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:07:58] <strong>Josepha:</strong> And then the second thing is actually that we have kind of a pilot program going on. There&#8217;s a proposal out right now about GatherPress. It&#8217;s a group of community leaders that have built a tool, a community plugin, to help gather WordPress events a bit better and a bit more &#8220;open source-ely&#8221;. It&#8217;s open currently to anyone who is running a WordPress meetup group that is interested in learning more about how a WordPress-first and open source first community gathering tool might look.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:08:32] <strong>Josepha:</strong> I&#8217;ll have a link to the proposal in the show notes that&#8217;ll give you more detailed information and give you an opportunity to figure out how you can join that pilot and help us figure out whether it will work or not ultimately for WordPress.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And that, my friends, is your small list of big things. Don&#8217;t forget to follow us on your favorite podcast app or subscribe directly on <code>WordPress.org/news</code>. You&#8217;ll get a friendly reminder whenever there&#8217;s a new episode. If you liked what you heard today, share it with a fellow WordPresser or fellow brand new WordCamper. But if you had questions about what you heard, you can share those with me at <code>wpbriefing@WordPress.org</code>. I&#8217;m your host, Josepha Haden Chomphosy.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:09:13] <strong>Josepha:</strong> Thanks again for tuning in today for the WordPress Briefing, and I&#8217;ll see you again in a couple of weeks.&nbsp;</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Mon, 04 Mar 2024 12:00:00 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:14:\"Brett McSherry\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:26;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:94:\"Do The Woo Community: Bringing DEIB to the WordPress Way Show with Birgit Olzem and Angela Jin\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:28:\"https://dothewoo.io/?p=79193\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:93:\"https://dothewoo.io/bringing-deib-to-the-wordpress-way-show-with-birgit-olzem-and-angela-jin/\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:457:\"<p>New host Birgit Olzem chats with Angela Jin about WordPress diversity, equity, inclusion and belonging in this debut monthly episode.</p>\n<p>&gt;&gt; The post <a href=\"https://dothewoo.io/bringing-deib-to-the-wordpress-way-show-with-birgit-olzem-and-angela-jin/\">Bringing DEIB to the WordPress Way Show with Birgit Olzem and Angela Jin</a> appeared first on <a href=\"https://dothewoo.io\">Do the Woo - a WooCommerce and WordPress Builder Podcast</a>	.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Mon, 04 Mar 2024 10:00:00 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:5:\"BobWP\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:27;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:112:\"WPTavern: WordPress Photo Festival 2024, A Five Part Retrospective, Part 5, What We Learned, Where We’re Going\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154596\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:116:\"https://wptavern.com/wordpress-photo-festival-2024-a-five-part-retrospective-part-5-what-we-learned-where-were-going\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:17242:\"<p>In this last episode about the Kerala WPPhotos Festival I talk not only about the project, but also where this project is leading us. Next Gen events are a breath of fresh air for those of us who need something more than the classic WordCamp.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>This article is available in video, audio, and transcribed text.</p>\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n<p>Audio version:</p>\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Transcription:</h2>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:00:00]</span> Welcome to the fifth and final episode in my series on the WordPress Photos events that happened in early February. In this episode, we&#8217;re going to rewind just a little bit and look at the project itself. Then we&#8217;re going to cover some really cool information about the event. And then lastly, we&#8217;re going to talk about next gen events in general and some cool things that are coming in the future and some really, some things that I&#8217;m really, really excited about.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So let&#8217;s get started. We&#8217;re looking here at the photos page for the project itself. There are currently <span>[00:01:00]</span> 15, 306 photos on this page or on this site. I&#8217;m going to zoom in a little bit so you can see some of these better. Most are taken with cell phones. , some are taken with high-end cameras. There are approximately 30 moderators that, watch over the project and make sure that quality pictures are getting in.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And as a moderator, I can tell you that I&#8217;ve been very, very pleased that, an extraordinarily low number of people have been or attempted to be naughty. Um, photos that are rejected are almost always because the submitter missed a face or a license plate, or. Or maybe didn&#8217;t read the rules precisely, but, I can only think of two or three photos where obviously somebody was trying to game the system and out of 15, 000, that&#8217;s really impressive.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I&#8217;m really <span>[00:02:00]</span> happy with that. Uh, something very important to note about these photos is that they are all under creative common zero, which you can see right here,</p>\n\n\n\n<p>creative common zero means no rights reserved. There are no rights reserved. You can do anything with the photo. Anyone can do anything with it. They can remix it. They can sell it. They can, they can use it for something you don&#8217;t agree with. So there&#8217;s good and there&#8217;s bad with it, but it provides an enormous amount of freedom.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And that&#8217;s what we wanted. We wanted to be able to provide images that you can put on your website without question, without having to wonder, Oh, is somebody going to come after me someday? So creative comm zero provides a lot of freedom, on this page. If you click. You can see the submitter. There&#8217;s an option to download in multiple <span>[00:03:00]</span> sizes.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>There&#8217;s the photo itself. Alternate text. There are tags and categories and colors. Some information about the camera. Information about the image itself. And then you&#8217;re not required to provide attribution. That&#8217;s part of the CC zero thing, but if you want you can and I recommend it it it&#8217;s it&#8217;s polite Uh, and when people find their own image out on the internet It&#8217;s kind of exciting.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>It&#8217;s pretty cool. So you can get it in rich text, HTML, or plain text.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So what about this event that happened? Bigul, who took this picture right here, his community did several photo walks over a couple of months and they were very successful. They got lots of pictures. People had a really good time. And somebody said, Hey, what if we, it is a global event. And so they started <span>[00:04:00]</span> in trying to make it a global event.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And they talked to the community team and made it a next gen event, which means they got support from the foundation and things like that. And they set up a website, which you can see right here. And a cool thing that happened during the event is that these cards were updated as photos were submitted.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I&#8217;m pretty sure Marcus Burnett had something to do with this because it looks like his work, but for observers, you could come here and watch this page change moment by moment, literally, I mean, it was one week and they got, 1, 500 photos or something. So that&#8217;s a lot of photos per day. And then, I wanted to show you the winners.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So one of the unique things about this event is that there was a contest involved. And there&#8217;s <span>[00:05:00]</span> money on the line, which has never happened at a WordPress event before the top five photographs got a hundred dollars each. And I have to say,  I was a judge, so I should agree with what was selected, but, the number one photo was this one.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And that was my number one, amongst, there were several judges, but I picked this one as my number one. Guess those kids look so happy. In a glorious place. Um, it&#8217;s just cool. And one of the rules is no fit, no human faces, but this one makes it because this is an unidentifiable human face. And so to be able to get a human face in and have it still follow the rules.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Is quite a trick. And I&#8217;m impressed. Um, another one that really, really impressed me was this one from Ninesh. We go <span>[00:06:00]</span> look at the detail on that. And then if you click again and again, you&#8217;re looking at individual feathers in this photo, that is incredible to me. So these are the kinds of photos that are making it into.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The photo repository. They&#8217;re good. They&#8217;re really, really good. Um, consolation prizes. Um, the next five basically we&#8217;re here and then they gave a hundred dollars to contributors and it didn&#8217;t say how many this person gave. So, I think we want this one. Yes. We make this bigger. Uh, Benita got 82 photos in one week.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, Nilo got 79. It&#8217;s around 65. One of the reasons that&#8217;s impressive is that you can only <span>[00:07:00]</span> upload five at a time, and then they have to be moderated before you can upload more. And, it was an incredible high amount of traffic that overwhelmed the moderators. Uh, well here you can see there was 1, 544 approved.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, there were about 400 not approved, so 2, 000 or so photos. We&#8217;re processed. That&#8217;s incredible. And so it&#8217;s not only impressive that they took 82 photos, but that they were managed to get them through the system that quickly, if you haven&#8217;t watched the Uh, episode with Nilo in it. He tells his secret about how he got to 79.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So if you want to know how to get photos through quickly, go watch that episode with Nilo.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So I want to talk for just a minute about, about the money because it&#8217;s different, it&#8217;s new. Um, and. <span>[00:08:00]</span> It was exciting and it was fun, but it was difficult. It was awkward. The WordCamp system is not built to, to give prize money to attendees. And so, things had to be fiddled with and tweaked and people had weird titles that they wouldn&#8217;t normally have just because they, other people couldn&#8217;t take money, et cetera.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>It was, it was weird and it was awkward. So if we were to ever go down this road again, we were probably, we need something to read, we would probably need to build something. And my guess is that&#8217;s not going to happen. Uh, in this particular instance, there was a surplus of cash because they had some sponsors and they were going to spend some money on advertising to get more people to attend.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So many people attended, they didn&#8217;t need to spend that money. And so there was a surplus and it got distributed. Uh, I don&#8217;t <span>[00:09:00]</span> anticipate that happening in a, a large number of word camps. Uh, since Covid Word camps are much more expensive, they&#8217;re much more difficult to find venues to get good food at a reasonable rate.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And so I don&#8217;t expect to see, money available again as at a, as a prize at a, at a event. What do I know? It could happen. Weirder things have happened. This happened, and I wouldn&#8217;t have said this would happen. Uh, so I&#8217;m very happy for the people who won. That&#8217;s, it was a surprise treat, and that&#8217;s great.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>But now I want to talk about next generation WordPress events, because, this was one of them. Since COVID, the community teams had a difficult time getting Word camps and meetups to reform to pick back up <span>[00:10:00]</span> and go again, especially in the U. S. And a lot of it had to do with money and a lot of it had to do with the mental Taxation it takes to have an event like this Um, doing a WordCamp is hard work.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>It takes a lot of time and energy, a lot of focus, and often things in your life suffer, family time, work time, and people who&#8217;ve done it before are thinking, well, maybe I don&#8217;t need to do that again. And people who haven&#8217;t done it before are thinking, I don&#8217;t know how to do that. I don&#8217;t, is that, is it okay?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Can I do that? Um, and then there&#8217;s the financial aspect. Venues are outrageously more expensive than they used to be before COVID. Uh, venues now need insurance and so they have to pay for that. <span>[00:11:00]</span> And they need more staff to, to do things that the insurance requires. So they have to pay for staff and in many places, venues cost double what they did before.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And we, we just don&#8217;t have the budget for that. Uh, food is similar since COVID there are a lot of new rules about. Food in public places are being served to large groups and that requires insurance, requires new equipment, all that stuff. So the costs of events have gone way up. So one of the things that the community team wanted to come up with was a cheaper way to get it done.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, what is, what is the goal of a WordCamp? What is its purpose? Uh, for me, personally, for a lot of years, it&#8217;s been to see my friends. And as much fun as that is, honestly, It&#8217;s not a good investment. Um, I can go see my friends, but much cheaper ways. Um, but if our, if our purpose is to, <span>[00:12:00]</span> to educate people, to further their careers, their knowledge, their wisdom to advance WordPress, then there might be better ways to do it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And I&#8217;m not saying we&#8217;re going to get rid of work camps the way they&#8217;ve always been, we&#8217;ll keep those. But, there are some really, really great new ideas on how to do things in the future. Um, this photo festival costs almost nothing. That&#8217;s one of the reasons they had a few hundred dollars to give away.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Um, there was no venue, there was no food, there was no. Lighting people. There were no audio people. Um, and yet it was a huge success. People had a really good time. So I want to show you a few other events. So coming up in Switzerland is a community day, which is just like a, contributor day at a word camp.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>It&#8217;s just there, <span>[00:13:00]</span> there aren&#8217;t talks. And it&#8217;s only one day. And so there doesn&#8217;t necessarily need to be food. Um, it&#8217;s quick, it&#8217;s focused and it gets things done. Uh, this one&#8217;s exciting. These next three are exciting to me because they&#8217;re all in Africa. The Misaka WordPress and education technology showcase gets, excuse me, gets local educators in Uganda to come together and look at what WordPress can do for them.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And that&#8217;s amazing because we all know that WordPress does well in. lower income communities where they need to be looking at tools and software that they can get and use that work really well without spending a ton of money. Uh, the Kampala Online Payments and Delivery Summit. I just laughed when I saw that one because online payments and delivery in Africa is a completely different animal than anywhere else.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, it&#8217;s hard. <span>[00:14:00]</span> Online payments. Just aren&#8217;t there for a lot of Africa. And so having a day focused on, on only that getting it done is brilliant. Um, Rome core days. If you weren&#8217;t here for my talk yesterday with Julia, I was, I told her I have been to contributor days to the core team, half a dozen times, maybe more.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And we&#8217;re always promised where you&#8217;re going to be a core contributor by the end of the day. And we spent all day long getting half the room set up with half of Docker. And at the end of the day, maybe one person has contributed and it&#8217;s frustrating because I feel like I&#8217;m doing it over and over again.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We never make progress, but what if there was a time where it was two days long and it&#8217;s completely focused on just that, and they have enough staff to help everybody rather than one person running around trying <span>[00:15:00]</span> to get everybody set up, that&#8217;s brilliant. Uh, I wanted to do this in my own city a couple of years ago.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And it never happened, but it might because now we have precedence. Uh, so this is great. Um, looking at some of the past ones, these are, these are great. The Kolkata career camp. Uh, I was just thinking about this today. Ever been to a college career day where there&#8217;s just a room full of employers? Um, the Kolkata one also had workshops and panel discussions, which I think are brilliant because, young people need to know how to find jobs.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>They need the wisdom when they&#8217;re approaching an employer to get a good, a good pay rate, a good vacation system, good compensation system. Um, having it wrapped around work camp. It&#8217;s absolutely brilliant. Um, then there&#8217;s, let&#8217;s see. I had one more down here.<span>[00:16:00]</span> </p>\n\n\n\n<p>Oh, there&#8217;s, there&#8217;s community day in Rome. That&#8217;s a different one. Here we go. Japan community building workshop. It&#8217;s all about building community. Um, it says the group will have a six month learning period. That&#8217;s way beyond a WordCamp. That&#8217;s, that&#8217;s a class, that&#8217;s a college level class. And to be able to learn all of that through WordPress is amazing.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So all these different kinds of events are, well these, these all happened already. Then these are coming up. But one of the keys to this is the community team wants new ideas very much. So if you have an idea, Hey, I could do this thing in my town. Um, they want to hear about it. When I was talking to Julia, I suggested in grand <span>[00:17:00]</span> Rapids, my city, we have, kind of a career day, but more about talking about WordPress as a career.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So we put up flyers and universities and around the city and say things like. Is web development for you? Come find out and we have, a room full of people hiring. We have the, well, just like, just like in Kolkata, we have those room, those talks panels about what does it mean to have a job in web development, in WordPress, maybe just, maybe not only WordPress, maybe we talk about Web dev in general, just working in tech, just all those things.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>If so, they very much want ideas for new kinds of events and you are the one who&#8217;s going to come up with that great idea, somebody has to, it&#8217;s like winning the lottery, you can&#8217;t come up <span>[00:18:00]</span> with a great idea if you don&#8217;t throw it out there and say, Hey, What do you think of my idea? So if you would put stuff in the comments here about some ideas for events, it doesn&#8217;t have to be made by you.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>You don&#8217;t have to do the event to say, this is an event I would like to go to. That would be great. Um, if you&#8217;re interested in signing up and actually doing an event, you can go to events. wordpress. org.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And you can see all the events that are going on here, WordCamps and the next gen ones. Here are, upcoming events. But then if you want to do one, up in the top right, there&#8217;s Organize an Event. And here&#8217;s all the information about different kinds of events and what it means to organize. Uh, there are meetups, WordCamps, contributor days, virtual events.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Do action hackathons are great. You <span>[00:19:00]</span> get a room full of WordPress nerds building things for people that need it. And it&#8217;s very exciting and fun. Uh, the looks on people&#8217;s faces when you, when you give them a finished product and one weekend it&#8217;s priceless. Um, so the frequently asked questions, things like that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Um, but this is where you can go to sign up to, to lead any one of these or to become a member of any one of them. So, if you&#8217;re interested, go for it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And that is the end of this episode. It&#8217;s been a, an exciting week for me doing this. I appreciate those that have watched. I appreciate those that have commented. It&#8217;s been, it&#8217;s been a lot of fun and I&#8217;ve talked to some really interesting people, more than, you know, because some interviews didn&#8217;t survive, but, it&#8217;s been a lot of fun and I <span>[00:20:00]</span> appreciate you.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Thanks for stopping by.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Fri, 01 Mar 2024 21:12:01 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:14:\"Topher DeRosia\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:28;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:87:\"WPTavern: Reflecting on WordCamp Phoenix 2024: Struggles, Successes, and the Road Ahead\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154592\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:95:\"https://wptavern.com/reflecting-on-wordcamp-phoenix-2024-struggles-successes-and-the-road-ahead\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:14948:\"<p>Seven months ago I registered for &amp; scheduled a trip to Phoenix Arizona for a non-WordPress-related event! Crazy, right? As luck would have it, four months later, WordCamp Phoenix had announced that their event would be for that same weekend I was to be in town. How lucky was I to have both of my passions collide?&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I packed up all my necessary items for the non-WP event earlier in the week, hopped on my flight on the Thursday before camp (WordCamp was scheduled for Friday &amp; Saturday), and headed West.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Though I could only attend for a half-day on Friday due to my other commitment, I did notice a few things that were different from past WordCamps. </p>\n\n\n\n<p>I reached out to the lead organizer <a href=\"https://phoenix.wordcamp.org/2024/organizers\">Raquel Manriquez</a> and we discussed the overall event compared to years past, struggles, and the future of WordCamps. Below are the questions and answers from the interview. </p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-text-color has-neutral-300-color has-alpha-channel-opacity has-neutral-300-background-color has-background\" />\n\n\n\n<p></p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><strong>AS: Can you provide a brief overview of this year&#8217;s WordCamp Phoenix 2024, the theme and you coming back as the Lead Organizer? </strong></h2>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>RM</strong>: There&#8217;s a loaded answer to that question! The theme question is quite interesting. At the beginning of the summer when we started planning we kind of tossed out ideas but we couldn&#8217;t come to a consensus. Some in the team threw out this idea of the “Joy of WordPress.” Like a Bob Ross sort of idea. Full disclosure, I was like, no, I don&#8217;t see it. What does that mean? And the team replied with, “You know, everything will be happy little websites”. I then said, “Happy little websites? Okay, that&#8217;s one thing. What else?” Someone added, “We&#8217;ll all wear Bob Ross wigs.” And I was like, “What? No, it&#8217;s gross!” I just couldn&#8217;t visualize it, so we kind of shelved the idea for a while.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Then back in December we brought on Amber Pechin as Content Wrangler. She&#8217;s an incredibly talented writer. She asked about our theme and I mentioned we really didn’t have one but we were kind of toying around with this idea of the Joy of WordPress.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The theme crept back in after our WP community starting fighting. And so, we kind of thought, let&#8217;s bring the joy back to what we fell in love with. You know, with the community, with open source, with democratizing publishing. She took that, ran with it, and created this entire like slide deck of what it means to have the Joy of WordPress being WordCamp Phoenix&#8217;s theme. So come full circle, our theme ended up being the Joy of WordPress. Our Wapuu is Bob Rosspuu and it&#8217;s really cute. And we included an art theme around it. I think last summer Matt Mullenweg <a href=\"https://twitter.com/photomatt/status/1681676886932332545\">tweeted</a>, that he&#8217;d like to see more art at WordCamps. That inspired us.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>On me being the lead organizer,… yes I was the lead again. I led in 2018 &amp; 2019 but didn&#8217;t want to lead again necessarily, but we didn&#8217;t have someone else to lead. A struggle of mine is when I&#8217;m misunderstood, misread, or misjudged. Like if someone is judging me for being loud and silly, I don&#8217;t feel offended because I know I&#8217;m that way. But when I’m judged for something I’m not, well, I really struggle. I didn&#8217;t want anyone to think that this is the Raquel show but at the end of the day, I can’t control what others think.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><strong>AS: Do you feel that the camp was successful?&nbsp;</strong></h2>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>RM</strong>: Well, that&#8217;s a two-part answer, and it would be yes and no. By my standards, and by WordCamp Phoenix standards in the past, it wasn&#8217;t what we expected. We have typically sold out every WordCamp since 2009. In the early years, 2009 to 2014, we were pretty much the biggest local camp. The only one bigger at the time was WordCamp San Francisco, which became WordCamp US.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>In Feb 2020 we had a 500-person event and then the pandemic hit. When we brought it back in March 2023 we sold 400 tickets and things felt good. The vibe of the event had great energy. But starting with planning this iteration in 2024, almost from the get-go it was hit with so much shit happening against us.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>WordCamps are changing with the future of WordCamps reiteration. So there’s that. That was a hard pill for us to swallow because we’ve always been more of a SuperCamp. Even in 2009, we had a huge event. We had huge sponsors like Uber and Cox Internet. We had a <a href=\"https://wordpress.tv/2009/11/13/matt-mullenweg-wordpress-roundtable-phx09/\">panel with Matt Mullenweg and Josh Strebel</a>, etc&#8230; so small events are not our jam.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And our 2023 March event gave us good reason to think that this is our community. This is how we show up. So proceeded to have the same #wcphx style event. We submitted our budget. It was denied. Basically due to it being too costly, they wanted us to get a venue that was sub $10k.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I sort of get it, but then again, we have a proven track record that we raise enough money. Even in 2023, we raised almost 30k and that&#8217;s a lot compared to a typical WordCamp. So, we were just put into a really hard place. Which is really what it comes down to. That happened early on and we were left scrambling to find a new venue.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I found a new venue at Phoenix College but it just wasn&#8217;t the same, as we&#8217;re used to being in actual event spaces. We&#8217;ve never been in a school/college, though I have been to many WordCamps held on campuses, and it was always a blast. So we weren&#8217;t opposed to it and figured it would be fine. But what became clear is that to create that true camp a good chunk of it would be outside. For me, sponsors are the most important aspects of a camp because camps need a lot of money and these sponsors come in knowing that there&#8217;s not going to be an ROI on their monetary investment. It&#8217;s going to be a different ROI, right? And now our Hallway Track/epicenter of WordCamp Phoenix would take place outside which is risky.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And we were delayed in announcing BY OUR VENUE! And we had a third of our speakers drop. The team got emotional. There was drama. Heartache. Broken friendships… I’m not even touching everything that went wrong. Murphy showed up in full force.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>AS: How was the engagement of the attendees?</strong></p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>RM:</strong> We sold 200 tickets which was embarrassing for me. I guess it was beyond our control. But my biggest thing is like, why? I feel like a lot of the hiccups and the hurdles, if not walls, that were placed in front of us (that I decided to hurdle-nay, bulldoze over), greatly affected our attendance. So, yeah, we sold 200 tickets when we sold 400 in 2023, so that&#8217;s quite a difference. In our metrics, Fridays always get the most amount of people so Saturday was sad panda.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>AS: </strong>Oh, really? Back at WCLAX Saturdays were always more popular and Sundays had a large drop-off. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>RM</strong>: I think people tend to look at Fridays like a work day and think “I’m gonna go to this work conference”. Then Saturday comes and they&#8217;re like, I want to hang with my fam.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And then the other thing was the weather. The highs were in the low 50s, and it was raining! Then we had to find awnings for the sponsors, just in case it actually rained when they were there, which thankfully never did happen.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>If I&#8217;m being honest, I felt guilty. I felt guilty that we had these two incredible keynote speakers who have been pivotal in the startup and entrepreneurial community in Phoenix from day one. They&#8217;ve always been supporters and sponsored our entire WordPress community and have hosted plenty of our meetups at their co-working spaces. To not have a full audience for them… The same thing with some of our speakers. I know we had a lot of feedback afterward regarding Quinn Tempest, Tanya Moushi, and Perry Collins and how incredible their talks were. All local women to Phoenix… but there weren&#8217;t hundreds of people to watch them.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><strong>AS: Have you gathered feedback from the event?</strong></h2>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>RM</strong>: Not yet. For the first time ever, I feel burnout (I didn’t think that could happen to me). The team is burnt out. And I have bragged to the world about how amazing our team is, how we don&#8217;t get burnout, how we have each other&#8217;s backs, and how if somebody drops a plate, someone&#8217;s there to help. It just didn&#8217;t happen like that this time around. And it&#8217;s really hard not to blame myself, even though I know and my head knows it&#8217;s not my fault. But my heart feels shame.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><strong>AS: Word on the street has it that you toss out the idea or you have the idea to do a regional WordCamp.</strong></h2>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>RM</strong>: Anybody who knows me knows my <em>why</em>. That is human connection. The reason I fell in love with WordPress is because there was this group of humans that genuinely wanted to connect for no reason other than we&#8217;re in this space together. So let&#8217;s connect. And I&#8217;d never experienced that in my life. So I fell head over heels, absolutely in love with this community, and made a career out of it. I love it. I love putting events on and I could do it in my sleep. I could plan an event off the top of my head, you know, a conference. It&#8217;s a labor of love.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I&#8217;ve had this idea of a regional for a long time. This dates back to pre-pandemic as I knew the rules: you had to have a local camp and you had to have several local camps in an area or region to have a regional and I was like, how cool would that be to have a Southwest region of the United States WordCamp. I remember approaching Matt Cromwell at Pressonomics 6, the very last one in September 2019.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I was like, I got this idea. Because we qualify, and we all love each other, because we&#8217;ve all kind of rotated at each other&#8217;s camps and stuff, and like, it kinda feels like we&#8217;re all in the same neighborhood. What if we had a regional? And I remember he liked it, but mentioned having to get WordCamp San Diego back up. And then he moved to Germany and the pandemic happened.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So, then fast forward to now, and we were just, like, gungho, let&#8217;s get Phoenix back, and we did. Then 2024 happens, and kind of coming back to the question you asked earlier if I regret 2024. I do not regret it at all. I love our community. I love my people so deeply. But it was not what we expected. And now I&#8217;m reflecting and know that we need to start doing something different. If everybody&#8217;s burnt out, then we need to change. The pandemic caused a lot of emotional burnout before we even did anything in person. Our community hasn’t fully recovered.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>You know what I mean? A lot of the community is just burnt out. Traveling to multiple cities from SoCal to Nevada to Arizona to attend a 1/2-day camp is less attractive. We got used to just chilling in our homes.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I&#8217;m on board with the future of WordCamps and the mission that&#8217;s now being laid out, but I want really cool, magical WordCamps still. Maybe it’s a dream? And I&#8217;m cool with it being one larger one (regional) versus a bunch of little ones than to have nothing at all. Which, might be where we end up. Personally, I don&#8217;t want to see a world where WordCamps are essentially a hackathon. That&#8217;s great to have a bunch of those, and I&#8217;m not against it at all. What I&#8217;m against is that only being it. And I&#8217;ll just come out and say it. I don&#8217;t want that to be the only existence of a WordCamp.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>AS: What&#8217;s the status then and what are the next steps for a regional WC to be approved?&nbsp;</strong></p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>RM</strong>: Well, back in the day, you had to have several meetups to then have an actual WordCamp. And then you had to have several local WordCamps to have a regional. And it really wasn&#8217;t an issue to a US-based camp. It was more of a Europe situation as my friend, Remkus wanted to have WordCamp Netherlands and had a journey getting that going. And now we&#8217;re seeing WordCamp Canada, right? When I saw Canada was announced, that rekindled my flame.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Phoenix is tired. I&#8217;m not tired, but I’m tired of everyone around me being tired and we need more leaders. We need more help. And I love my people. I love my team. We have true friendship with each other.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We deeply love each other. I care about them deeply. And I&#8217;m like, I can&#8217;t keep us going like this without actual help. So my hopelessly endearing self came up with the idea to officially have a WordCamp Southwest Regional.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The Southwest region has that magic like Phoenix has. THe Phoenix community loves each other,&nbsp; and all these communities of the SW US love each other too.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I am a 13-year-old girl, metaphorically speaking, who always has these big wide eyes in the way I view the world. Full disclosure, I definitely have this nostalgic attachment to the days when we went to each other&#8217;s WordCamps in the 20-teens. I’m working on it. That nostalgia that is.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Is it naive of me to think that everyone&#8217;s going to be on board? Probably. But, I&#8217;m still going to go for it and be that <em>all-things-are-possible</em> Raquel.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><strong>AS: What&#8217;s your timeline for a regional?&nbsp;</strong></h2>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>RM</strong>: Honestly, I want to start conversations now! But it won’t happen if we don’t have everyone on board.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><br /><strong>AS: Final question, what are your key takeaways from this year&#8217;s WordCamp. </strong></h2>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><strong>RM</strong>: The key takeaways are:</h2>\n\n\n\n<ol>\n<li>The community at large is going through a split in emotional ways that are affecting us physically and it sucks.</li>\n\n\n\n<li>WordCamp Phoenix needs more help to continue.</li>\n\n\n\n<li>I want to have a regional. I would like our next iteration to be a regional, whether that&#8217;s spring or fall 2025 I&#8217;m not sure, but a girl can dream.</li>\n\n\n\n<li>Turns out, I do have a capacity so I am going to take some time and not volunteer so much. (famous last words)</li>\n</ol>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Fri, 01 Mar 2024 20:15:00 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:11:\"Adam Silver\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:29;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:65:\"WPTavern: Acquisition Alert: Kestrel Acquires Seven Barn2 Plugins\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154576\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:75:\"https://wptavern.com/acquisition-alert-kestrel-acquires-seven-barn2-plugins\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:2849:\"<p>Katie Keith, CEO of Barn2, <a href=\"https://barn2.com/blog/new-home-for-7-plugins/\">announced</a> that Kestrel has acquired seven plugins from her company for an undisclosed amount. She had <a href=\"https://twitter.com/KatieKeithBarn2/status/1747682958083789027\">tweeted</a> about her plans to sell the plugins back in January to focus on the more profitable plugins. </p>\n\n\n\n<p>This is <a href=\"https://kestrelwp.com/\">Kestrel</a>’s first acquisition. Kestrel is a new venture by the former co-founders of <a href=\"https://wptavern.com/godaddy-acquires-skyverge-creator-of-over-60-woocommerce-add-ons\">SkyVerge</a> (creator of over 60 WooCommerce add-ons and acquired by GoDaddy in 2020). Their website describes the team as “a small but mighty team of seasoned WooCommerce professionals — we’re some of the top non-Automattic contributors to the open source WooCommerce project.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The acquisition encompasses five premium plugins and two free plugins, including <a href=\"https://kestrelwp.com/product/variation-prices-woocommerce/\">WooCommerce Variation Prices</a>, <a href=\"https://kestrelwp.com/product/express-shop-page-woocommerce/\">WooCommerce Express Shop Page</a>, <a href=\"https://kestrelwp.com/product/shipping-calculator-woocommerce/\">WooCommerce Shipping Calculator</a>, <a href=\"https://kestrelwp.com/product/product-sample-woocommerce/\">WooCommerce Product Sample</a>, <a href=\"https://kestrelwp.com/product/discontinued-products-woocommerce/\">WooCommerce Discontinued Products</a>, and the free plugins <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/plugins/woo-custom-add-to-cart-button/\">WooCommerce Custom Add to Cart Button</a> and <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/plugins/better-recent-comments/\">Better Recent Comments</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Katie explained, “it makes sense to put the most resources into the plugins which have the biggest user base and which fit best with our other plugins. As a result, in early 2024 we made a team decision that we should sell some of our plugins to a company who will give them the attention they deserve so that we can concentrate our efforts on providing even greater value and support for our remaining suite of plugins.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Under the acquisition terms, the existing annual and lifetime customers will continue to receive full support, updates and maintenance from the Kestral team. Barn2 has plans in place for customers who purchased the acquired plugins through bundle plans and the All Access Pass plan.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Max Rice, Founding Engineer of Kestrel told us, “We’re very excited to jump back into the Woo space with the launch of Kestrel! We’ve worked with WooCommerce since 2012, and have been familiar with Barn2&#8217;s work for some time — we’re excited to kickstart our new venture with a group of high-quality plugins from a team we respect.”</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Fri, 01 Mar 2024 19:13:33 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:7:\"Jyolsna\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:30;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:62:\"WPTavern: The Block Bindings API Brings Dynamic Data to Blocks\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154569\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:73:\"https://wptavern.com/the-block-bindings-api-brings-dynamic-data-to-blocks\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:7936:\"<p>As the block editor continues to evolve its content management capabilities, the lack of support for custom fields has been one of the key roadblocks for users and developers. While custom fields in WordPress are still widely used, in the block editor they&#8217;ve been relegated to a drawer at the bottom of the screen, and haven&#8217;t been as deeply integrated as many would like. With the coming <a href=\"https://github.com/WordPress/gutenberg/issues/54536\">Block Bindings API</a>, things are about to change in a very good way.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">What is the Block Bindings API?</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>One of the best ways to explain the Block Bindings API is to start with a plugin like WooCommerce.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Imagine you are building your WooCommerce store and you&#8217;re designing the homepage of your site with blocks. You&#8217;re using a Query Loop to display your most popular products, which means many of the blocks you&#8217;ll be reaching for are probably pulling important custom information about your products- product descriptions, images, galleries, add-to-cart buttons, and more.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Right now, WooCommerce needs to create and manage individual <em>custom</em> blocks for each of those separate pieces of content. That&#8217;s a lot of duplicate code and technological overhead. Plus, as new design tools are added to the block editor, the development team has to go back each release and make sure their custom blocks can support new features properly. Wouldn&#8217;t it make much more sense if they could use core blocks &#8211; like a paragraph, heading, or button block &#8211; and just tell WordPress to &#8220;connect&#8221; that block to the product data?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>That&#8217;s just one example of the promise of the Block Bindings API, and custom fields are only one of many use-cases. Once the foundation has been laid, this <a href=\"https://github.com/WordPress/gutenberg/issues/54536\">feature can extend</a> to all types of data that have been relatively hard to manage in the block editor, from populating post and site information (like Author Name or Featured Image) to helping Synced Patterns become more robust.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Can dynamic data save time and resources?</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>To learn more about the Block Bindings API, I reached out to Scott Kingsley Clark, Lead Developer of the <a href=\"https://pods.io/\">Pods Framework</a> and the driving force behind the <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/tag/fields-api/\">Fields API feature project</a> in WordPress Core. The Fields API proposal circles around a similar issue in WordPress: how can we help developers avoid writing the same code over and over?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>That&#8217;s the problem that tools like Pods and Advanced Custom Fields rose to solve. They save developers from writing the same custom post type code, custom settings screens, and custom field inputs from scratch on every project. Scott drew the connection between his work and WooCommerce, pointing out that many of the contributors to the Block Binding API are in fact contributors to WooCommerce as well.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>&#8220;The new WooCommerce Product edit screen is powered by Blocks,&#8221; Scott explains, &#8220;and you can totally see the progression over the releases they’ve done on that feature as they’ve abstracted more things and started to find ways to consolidate, instead of &#8216;every specific field has to be their own specific block&#8217; which has been holding them back.&#8221;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Scott has been providing feedback on the API and is working on making sure the Pods Framework has an integration ready to go before WordPress 6.5 releases on March 26th.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I also asked Iain Poulson, Product Manager for <a href=\"https://www.advancedcustomfields.com/\">Advanced Custom Fields</a>, if we might see ACF&#8217;s custom fields using this API to connect to core blocks in the future.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>&#8220;The ACF team have been following the development of the Block Bindings API closely over the last few months,&#8221; says Iain. &#8220;We’re currently exploring building our own binding source to allow users to use ACF field values to be bound to block attributes, and hope to have a working prototype soon.&#8221;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>There was originally a chance that custom fields from plugins like Pods and ACF might work out of the box, but some last minute <a href=\"https://github.com/WordPress/gutenberg/pull/59326\">security cleanup</a> meant that any plugin with a more custom approach will need to build their own integration with the API.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>&#8220;We’re aware of a PR merged today into WordPress core which is likely to mean ACF fields won’t be bindable without this work,&#8221; Iain told me earlier this week. &#8220;We expect the future to change significantly over coming releases of WordPress with new UIs for connections and the ability to update values from the binding itself, all of these features we’d love to bring to ACF users, and will be working with the WordPress core team to make sure we can.&#8221;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>It&#8217;s exciting to know that major plugins are invested in this new API. What&#8217;s also important here is to temper expectations about the API. There&#8217;s a <a href=\"https://github.com/WordPress/gutenberg/issues/41236\">long roadmap</a> and plenty of experimentation that needs to happen before we see it deeply embedded in developer workflows.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">This is an API without a UI?</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Though the WordPress 6.5 release includes the Block Bindings API in core, we&#8217;re not going to see an actual user interface for this feature just yet. This is still an &#8220;under the hood&#8221; feature, but its inclusion means it&#8217;s ready for plugin and theme developers to start building on top of.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>In 6.5, Block Binding can only be used one of two ways, both of which involve touching a little code:</p>\n\n\n\n<ol>\n<li>You can take the approach <a href=\"https://developer.wordpress.org/news/2024/02/20/introducing-block-bindings-part-1-connecting-custom-fields/\">advocated in the WordPress Developer Blog</a>: switch the block editor into the &#8220;Code editor&#8221; mode and add the binding metadata directly to the block HTML.</li>\n\n\n\n<li>You can utilize the <a href=\"https://developer.wordpress.org/block-editor/reference-guides/block-api/block-variations/\">Block Variations API</a> to add a version of a core block with your binding metadata already baked in. This will require placing some JavaScript in a theme or plugin, but the benefit is that it &#8220;just works&#8221; once you&#8217;re inside the content editor, because your variation shows up as its own block in the block inserter.</li>\n</ol>\n\n\n\n<p>The current implementation only supports four core blocks (Paragraph, Heading, Button, and Image), the truth is that those four blocks are<a href=\"https://gutenstats.blog/\"> some of the most commonly used content</a> blocks and will make up the vast majority of use cases, though other blocks are planned. For end users, this means that any blocks using this API will function exactly like the core blocks they’re already familiar with, a win for usability.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The <a href=\"https://github.com/WordPress/gutenberg/issues/53300\">tracking issue</a> for the project makes it clear that a no-code interface for the Block Bindings API is coming, with some proof-of-concept examples already being explored. By taking this API-first approach, the core team can see how the feature is used in the wild before committing to change in the block editor, and perhaps take some inspiration as plugin teams build out their own integrations.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>If you&#8217;re an end user, you might not notice anything new just yet. But if you&#8217;re a plugin or theme developer, it might be time to explore the Block Bindings API and see if you can&#8217;t take advantage of this time-saving feature.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Fri, 01 Mar 2024 17:57:09 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:12:\"Brian Coords\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:31;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:90:\"Do The Woo Community: All Things CloudFest 2024 Hackathon with Christian, Carole and Alain\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:28:\"https://dothewoo.io/?p=79186\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:88:\"https://dothewoo.io/all-things-cloudfest-2024-hackathon-with-christian-carole-and-alain/\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:442:\"<p>CloudFest CEO Christian Jäger joins Carole Olinger and Alain Schlesser for a conversation for the 2024 Hackathon at CloudFest.</p>\n<p>&gt;&gt; The post <a href=\"https://dothewoo.io/all-things-cloudfest-2024-hackathon-with-christian-carole-and-alain/\">All Things CloudFest 2024 Hackathon with Christian, Carole and Alain</a> appeared first on <a href=\"https://dothewoo.io\">Do the Woo - a WooCommerce and WordPress Builder Podcast</a>	.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Fri, 01 Mar 2024 07:05:00 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:5:\"BobWP\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:32;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:98:\"WPTavern: WordPress Photo Festival 2024, A Five Part Retrospective, Part 4, Next Generation Events\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154538\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:106:\"https://wptavern.com/wordpress-photo-festival-2024-a-five-part-retrospective-part-4-next-generation-events\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:28784:\"<p>In the penultimate episode of this series I talk with Julia Golomb from the WordPress Community Team about Next Generation WordPress Events.  We&#8217;ll include how the WPPhotos Event was a great template, and other ideas that could come.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>This article is available in video, audio, and transcribed text.</p>\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n<p>Audio version:</p>\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Transcription</h2>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:00:00]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Welcome back! In this episode, we&#8217;re going to talk with Julia from the community team about next generation WordPress events, what that means, what they are and how you can be involved. There are a lot of great ideas coming out about different things that we can do for events and I&#8217;m really excited about it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So come along with me while we have this conversation. I&#8217;m here with Julia from the community team.  please tell us your, your full name and where you&#8217;re from. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:00:50]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> All right. Hey Topher. My name is Julia Golomb and I am bi-coastal in the US I spend half my time. Well, a little more than half my <span>[00:01:00]</span> time in the Bay area of California, just outside of Oakland, California.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And the, maybe a third of my time in the Northeast United States, mostly around New Hampshire, outside Boston. Very nice. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:12]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> And I know you&#8217;re in the community team, but, what do you do? you know, what&#8217;s your role there?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:19]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> Yeah. So I am a full time contributor to the WordPress community team and I&#8217;m sponsored by Automattic.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So AutomatTic donates my time to work full time with the WordPress community. And my role involves helping meetup organizers and helping WordCamp organizers and WordPress event organizers all over the world, create great events that. Bring folks together to celebrate WordPress and learn from each other and build community and gain inspiration and connections.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>All right. That&#8217;s very cool. And I&#8217;m also, I&#8217;m, I&#8217;m also on the lead organizing team for Word Camp US this year and was for 23 as <span>[00:02:00]</span> well. So I bring that flagship organizing experience too. Yeah. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:02:04]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong>  our, our main story is about,  the photos event that happened, Carla, but I keep hearing the organizers say things like,  second generation event.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>What does that mean?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:02:19]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> All right. So glad you asked. In late spring of 2023, the community team kicked off a pilot project that was called NextGen WordPress Events. And the idea of this pilot project was to think outside the box about how WordPress organizers, WordPress enthusiasts around the world can organize events that are different from the traditional WordCamp format and the traditional Meetup format.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Because previously, those were the two main formats that the community team offered. For word camp event organizers. <span>[00:03:00]</span> The next gen pilot project offered an invitation to organizers around the world to experiment. So we said, bring us your ideas. What sorts of events do you want to see that are different from a word camp?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Or it could be a word camp, but a different flavor and style of word camp than we&#8217;re used to seeing. And. We at the end of 2023 concluded that pilot project and learned from that experience that yes, the community is thirsty for experimentation and there&#8217;s a lot of an opportunity for different types of events besides WordCamps.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And so now we&#8217;re, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:03:40]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> what kinds of things that people do? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:03:45]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> Great question.  so I know you are talking about the photo festival. That&#8217;s an example of a. That&#8217;s an example of a next gen event that was part of the pilot project. But I will just say <span>[00:04:00]</span> that now we are we&#8217;ve closed the pilot project stage. And now the community team has created an ongoing invitation to WordPress organizers to organize innovative, creative WordPress events.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And so we&#8217;re not. Not even calling them next gen. Although I think people still, that language has stuck, but WordPress events now. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:04:29]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah, that&#8217;s really cool. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:04:32]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong>  and next gen at the time, the name came up as. It means next generation of WordCamp. So we were so used to work. What&#8217;s the next generation of these events that people learn and connect and build real world skills and all of that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:04:51]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah.  I will admit I love WordCamps. I love the traditional ones, but I haven&#8217;t really been to a session in <span>[00:05:00]</span> years because I&#8217;ve been to so many of them, but I really want to do is hang out with my friends. Yes, and a different kind of event could facilitate that without the guilt of my other friends being in a session that I&#8217;m not listening to.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:05:16]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> Absolutely, I&#8217;ll share another example. You asked for some examples. Yeah The photo festival that just concluded in Japan. There&#8217;s a monthly series of community building workshops and those are online events That I think they helped started as online events, but then became in person events and it&#8217;s an opportunity to,  for community members to come together and learn about how they can be community wordpress community organizers across.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yeah, meant to build up the community team and that roster of. Organizers. And in Rome in September of 2023, there was a community day and that was a day <span>[00:06:00]</span> dedicated to WordPress community event organizers. There&#8217;s, ah, coming up in Rome, an event called Core Days. Okay. And that&#8217;s focused on, I believe, focused on core WordPress core contributions.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Right.  that&#8217;ll be in November of this year. So that&#8217;s a ways from now.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:06:23]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Okay. That&#8217;s really great. I&#8217;m really glad to hear that because I have thought in the past myself about trying to do a core focused only event that is days long because I&#8217;ve, I&#8217;ve been to work camps where I joined contributor day.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And I say, I&#8217;m going to contribute to core today. And eight hours later, I have Docker halfway set up and I&#8217;m lost and I&#8217;ve never contributed anything at any of those, but what if it were four days long and you spent two days getting Docker set up and then <span>[00:07:00]</span> contributing? That would be great. So I&#8217;m really happy to hear that they&#8217;re doing that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Now I have to go to Rome. So thank you very much. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:07:07]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> Yes. And something that we&#8217;ve observed in the U S in particular and North America is that word camps. And meetups have been slow to reenergize and reactivate since. Yes, I&#8217;ve noticed. And I think there&#8217;s gradual momentum building, but the landscape has really changed.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Things are more expensive. Venues are more expensive. Mm-Hmm. Covid was a real disruption in the flow and progression of. WordCamps. And so, I think that WordPress events, more broadly, my hope is that WordPress events offer</p>\n\n\n\n<p>the opportunity for more creativity for, for organizers to think about what is it that their community really wants and needs and what will enable <span>[00:08:00]</span> people to come out of their houses. Right. And working from home to actually be together. What are the skills that folks are looking to build? For example, I&#8217;ve heard a New York city meetup organizer talk about the possibility of organizing an event that targets recent graduates who are looking for jobs and, and want to learn about how WordPress can actually help them gain employment.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And that&#8217;s something that is different that people can&#8217;t just go on YouTube for like identifying what is the real value that this particular community. Is looking for and how to Yeah, like a more targeted event. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:08:43]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> That&#8217;s a great idea because looking back, basically every session I&#8217;ve ever given, talked at could be just a YouTube video.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And if we can make something that you can&#8217;t get on YouTube, that&#8217;s going to be really valuable.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:08:57]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> Yes. And so it really depends on creativity. It really <span>[00:09:00]</span> depends on an organizer in the box and trying something new and experimenting. And probably some events won&#8217;t. Won&#8217;t work so well. And that&#8217;s okay because that&#8217;s a learning and I hope that organizers will share their learnings with the community through posts on make a community.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>For example, from the community team recently posted a recap of the Jakarta WordPress website challenge. Website pitching competition. That was just held in January. And Devon&#8217;s share is it&#8217;s great. She really shares a lot of good info and good, good lessons learned. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:09:38]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> That&#8217;s really great.  I I&#8217;ve, I&#8217;ve talked to a number of organizers since COVID during COVID and things, and have heard, as you mentioned.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>How much more expensive things are a venue or food?  I think, I <span>[00:10:00]</span> think I heard a meetup for an evening in London, England was going to be 10, 000 or something. And yeah, I mean, it&#8217;s outrageous and New York City is the same.  the organizers there will have a cap on their meetup of 10 people because they, their, their room doesn&#8217;t hold more than 10 and it&#8217;s 2, 000 for the evening.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>For 10 people to get together and chat. So we, you know, we need the creativity. So,  I would love to hear if you can tell me some of the financially creative things people are doing to have a great time, get good things done without spending 10, 000 an evening for a meetup. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:10:44]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> Absolutely. Well, sponsorship, I will start by saying the WordPress events program depends on our sponsors and really important to.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Make sure that that&#8217;s a reciprocal relationship. <span>[00:11:00]</span> So think about how can we, what value do sponsors receive from their sponsorship and how can community events support our sponsors? Our sponsors are part of the WordPress ecosystem, just like the rest of us. Right. That&#8217;s one piece.  sponsorships are really important and that could be an in kind sponsorship of donating a venue.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>It doesn&#8217;t need to be. It doesn&#8217;t only need to come in the form of financial or monetary. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:11:30]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> That would be so cool. Like I&#8217;m on meetups at the WP engine office or the Automattic office in San Francisco.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:11:39]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> Yes. And I&#8217;m here in the Bay area and I&#8217;m really trying to get the San Francisco meetup reactivated. And I, it is amazing to know that the Automattic space in San Francisco could be made available.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And similarly, Automattic is offered to donate the know how right.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:11:59]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> <span>[00:12:00]</span> Yeah. In New York.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:12:00]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> Yeah. Yep. So it&#8217;s a resource. It&#8217;s a space that&#8217;s available and takes a little bit of coordination, but it&#8217;s, it&#8217;s there for the New York city meetup organizers. So my first encouragement for. Organizers. There&#8217;s a couple, there&#8217;s many things I want to say here, but my first encouragement is think about how you can find a donated space and okay.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Number two around finances, they are, the landscape is different and I do budget reviews often with meetup organizers and I mentor WordCamps and help them shape their budgets. And the community team recently has been telling organizers, sharing with organizers, what we observe because we&#8217;re working with a lot of different WordCamps and WordPress events.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And so I patterns. And one of the patterns is there&#8217;s less sponsorship, money available now than There used to be another pattern is that WordCamp <span>[00:13:00]</span> organizers really want to organize several hundred person events and it is. It&#8217;s just not there. And that is okay. Small events are so meaningful and important and impactful.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So I could not measure the success of an event by the number of attendees. I would set expectations, encourage organizers to set expectations at the outset for number of attendees. And understand that a 100 person event is, from my, absolutely from my perspective, as important and valuable as a 500 person event.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Okay. And I&#8217;m just going to pause and, and think for a moment. There&#8217;s something I want to say around this. All that to say, I think that creative WordPress events are really helpful for shifting out of the mindset of like the idea that, oh, it needs to be a WordCamp and that a WordCamp needs to be a big endeavor that feeds people and maybe is multiple days.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>WordPress <span>[00:14:00]</span> events open up the possibility of offering or organizing a half day workshop. That is specifically for digital marketers or a half day session that&#8217;s about building job skills, or is for folks focused on SEO, or want to contribute to the WordPress photo, photos team, photos library. There&#8217;s, there&#8217;s so much that can be done that can be low budget and still really rewarding and impactful.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:14:37]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> That&#8217;s really, really cool.  I&#8217;ve always wanted to do a, a seminar or whatever in my city on WordPress as a career. Maybe you&#8217;re laid off, maybe you&#8217;re just out of college, maybe you&#8217;re just out of high school. What do I want to do? I don&#8217;t want to do what I was doing before is web development for <span>[00:15:00]</span> me, you know.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:15:01]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> It sounds like you&#8217;ve got some really good ideas. I want to see you organize a WordPress event. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:15:08]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah, wow, that&#8217;s another thing all together. I want to see WordCamp San Francisco, so. You do yours. I&#8217;ll do mine. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:15:16]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> And my idea for WordCamp San Francisco is that it would be small. I&#8217;m thinking like, I know WordCamp San Francisco used to be hundreds of people.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I love to start with a one day. WordCamp San Francisco at the Automattic space, the Automattic office of the mission, which people that can accommodate maybe a 100 and fewer than 100, keep it a one track one day gathering. That&#8217;s about bringing community together and creating the Bay area WordPress community.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And it, it, it doesn&#8217;t need to be, I&#8217;m not benchmarking it against something that happened in the past and thinking about it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:15:55]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> It was, it was the flagship. Yeah, you know, you&#8217;re not going to do that again, <span>[00:16:00]</span> </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:16:01]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> but but just having any event that brings people together in the Bay Area would be so meaningful.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And this is what the world, any event that brings people together is meaningful, whether it&#8217;s 50 people or people are 150. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:16:16]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> So I want to take what you&#8217;ve said here and abstract it back to the photos event.  there was no venue, so that was not a thing. We didn&#8217;t, you know, there&#8217;s no money spent on a venue.</p>\n\n\n\n<p> the, I don&#8217;t know, I want to say talks. The, it was like, there was a few talks on the first day and a few at the last day, but there wasn&#8217;t a time when everybody sat in front of their computer for six hours and listened to people talk.  people got out, got outside, wandered around.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So, and I, and I know they they mentioned that they were going to do <span>[00:17:00]</span> some ads by ad space to get people to participate, but they got so many people just by word of mouth that they didn&#8217;t need that money for that. And so they&#8217;re right there and there&#8217;s, you know, pushing back the financials.  and a testament to their, their ability to get the word out.</p>\n\n\n\n<p> they did a great job.  given the number of people around the world, it would, it seems like it&#8217;d be hard to To make it really international and they did a good job. I was very impressed. I was sick. I was at death&#8217;s door through that whole week and I was very sad. So I missed it all.  </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:17:40]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> you made it to the other side.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I&#8217;m glad you did not walk through death&#8217;s door. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:17:42]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yes.  I should have at the last minute to be a judge and that&#8217;s it. But,  but you know, I got to see that. I got to hear. hear them in a zoom meeting talking about it and, and things like that. And,  now I get to do this event. So <span>[00:18:00]</span> I&#8217;ve been talking for a while now.</p>\n\n\n\n<p> tell me some of the things that made the photos thing really stand out as a great model for next gen events. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:18:13]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> Yeah. Oh, so many, so many things.  the first is that it is such a creative format. It&#8217;s new, it&#8217;s different. It&#8217;s something that I&#8217;d never seen before as a WordPress event. It was targeted. It had a very specific, the communication around it was very clear about what it was and how to get involved, including for folks for whom it was the first time contributing to the WordPress photo library.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yeah.  in fact, I contributed my first photo. I don&#8217;t think I officially registered for the event, but it inspired me to contribute my cat. Yeah. And then I looked through at all the other cat photos that had been uploaded. <span>[00:19:00]</span> </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:01]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> So cool. It needs more. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:02]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> I can help you out with that. There&#8217;s a lot. Yeah, a lot of WordPress can help you out with cat photos.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>That&#8217;s for sure. So one thing was simply like the outside of the box thinking to come up with the way in which it was regionally targeted and yet online so that I felt like folks around the world were invested in it and could participate in it but also had a sense of Interest. So it&#8217;s sure. Interest to folks all over the world, super low budget online.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And I do, I think there&#8217;s a huge value to in person events too. So I am not by any means saying we should have online events and not a mix of both is useful. And this was a really engaging online event. It&#8217;s different. It&#8217;s not something that. You can go onto YouTube and find it&#8217;s, it&#8217;s an interactive format where everybody contributes and learns.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:20:00]</span>  those are some of the pieces that I would highlight and it&#8217;s fun. It&#8217;s like, it&#8217;s fun and rewarding and interactive. And I love all of that. I think it was just fantastic. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:20:15]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah, it was really fun to watch all of all the pictures come in and see everybody do everything.  I have an RSS feed of. Of everything it&#8217;s the fire hose and for until now it&#8217;s been 30 or 40 a day and I just go through them every day.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I, I was at 2000 photos to view after the end of the event and I&#8217;m down to 980 now. But it is fun to see everybody&#8217;s photos to see their home, you know, not their house, but you know, like where they&#8217;re from what they do Yes, and takes so many pictures of Southern California mountains, <span>[00:21:00]</span> and they&#8217;re great and Bigel he lives in Kerala, but it&#8217;s so many photos from Europe.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>They&#8217;re all over the place And now I want to, I want to have a conversation with him, you know, tell me about this.  so yeah, go ahead.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:21:19]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> This is something that is really cool about that particular event format or event type. It connects people socially. So it&#8217;s, it really is a way of getting a glimpse into people&#8217;s lives, a glimpse into what people care about.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And there&#8217;s a personal touch to it. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:21:39]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> And what&#8217;s interesting to me is that when I think about personal touch in WordCamps, I think in person. We have a conversation, you touch someone&#8217;s shoulder, but you&#8217;re never going to sit at a WordCamp and look at an iPad for an hour of their photos. You know, but you would at home, you know, you&#8217;ll flip through <span>[00:22:00]</span> a couple of hundred photos from the day of an event and see where everybody was and what they did and all that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And it&#8217;s a different, it&#8217;s a very personal thing. You&#8217;re not gonna get in person. I think that&#8217;s pretty cool. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:22:13]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> I agree. I&#8217;d like to ask big, who is the organizer of the event to write a recap for the community team page around Sure. What the, was like organizing it and what, what lessons did he learn? What were the successes, what might he do differently at really with the purpose of inspiring other folks to organize events.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Not the same type of event, but Mm-Hmm. to think about what, what are they passionate about? That Yeah. They, and bring people together around. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:22:43]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah, there&#8217;s a lot of wisdom there from now. Now people have done it.  I have already interviewed him So if you keep your eye on the tavern in the next few days You&#8217;ll see All right.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:23:00]</span> I don&#8217;t know that I have anything more for you Have I mentioned at the beginning? I don&#8217;t know a whole lot about next gen. Did I miss anything? Anything you need to get out there? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:23:12]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> Let&#8217;s see.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>There&#8217;s a last piece, which is the idea of these other WordPress event types. Is that we really want WordPress events that are, that don&#8217;t require too great of an effort by organizers. So they&#8217;re doable, right? Are workable, meaning if an event inspires somebody across the globe or across the country, or.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Down the road from you that another organizer could replicate it. Right. Available. Meaning that if you wait, say that word again. Scalable, so scalable, meaning if 10 people participate, that&#8217;s great. If you want to grow the event or someone else wants to grow an event, a similar event and have 100 people <span>[00:24:00]</span> participate, that could work as well.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And then desirable for attendees, meaning it serves a purpose, it offers some value to attendees, that value could be Tangible skills or knowledge. It could be connection. It could be job offers. There&#8217;s, it could be contribution. There&#8217;s so many different ways to offer value to attendees, desirable and meaningful to the attendees.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So doable, replicable, scalable, and desirable. Those are the key metrics for what would be a successful WordPress event. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:24:35]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Well done. I&#8217;ll put those in bullet points on the screen. All right.  I did think of one more thing.  I was thinking about more Photos events. Do, do we want to have many per year or one per year?</p>\n\n\n\n<p> despite the fact that this was an international event, A lot of <span>[00:25:00]</span> Indians were took took place because it was based in Kerala, which makes sense. And I almost think I&#8217;d like to see it be sort of like flagship events, but there&#8217;s a city that organizes it and it&#8217;s still international, but. It&#8217;s not big and his team, you know what I mean?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And it&#8217;s and, and we would end up seeing a lot of photos of each, like the city that it&#8217;s in as well as international. But I&#8217;d like to see it move around and have it be organized by different people. And I don&#8217;t know if we could handle more than a, more than one a month, it would kill us. . </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:25:46]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> Yeah.  you say it would kill us, you, the photos, the photo team?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:25:50]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. Do you know,  Michelle Frechette, of course. Yes, she personally moderated 1, <span>[00:26:00]</span> 200 photos last week. That&#8217;s just insane. A lot of photos. And so we would need a much larger moderator team if we were gonna You know, ramp this up, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:26:15]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong>  next to the idea of the WordPress event being replicable. The idea that right.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We quit big old created and replicate it elsewhere.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:26:29]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. Wow. This has been really great. I&#8217;m really excited.  yeah, I&#8217;ve had a ton of ideas over the years. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:26:37]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> Yay. And if your readers, listeners, viewers are inspired by event. Yeah. and this conversation . They can apply to organize a WordPress event and, and where each team receives those applications. We vet them and then we follow up with that orientation and get them <span>[00:27:00]</span> going.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And really like I&#8217;ll, I&#8217;ll share, I&#8217;ll let you know where they can apply. But one thing I want to. I really encourage organizers to think about events that are manageable, that will not cause burnout, that will not be too stressful. And having low cost events is a really good way to help manage that stress level, because the more expensive an event is, the more stressful it gets.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>More more on the line, right? Doable piece like we want organizers to find the process of organizing event to be so rewarding and for them to want to come back and do it again next year and and managing managing burnout, making managing overwhelm, making sure that event is. It&#8217;s doable. It&#8217;s a really good way to support that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>That&#8217;s where, where can they, where can somebody apply?  I have to find the link. So <span>[00:28:00]</span> this is going to, would, could I? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:02]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> You can send it to me later. I&#8217;ll put it on the screen.  during editing because editing is magic. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:10]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> Yeah. That&#8217;s indeed. I&#8217;ve got it right here. Okay. I will say if folks have questions also, they can always come to the community events channel and slack.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And that&#8217;s a great place to, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:21]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Oh, that is a great place. Yes. You&#8217;re right. Many eyes from all. Yeah. </p>\n\n\n\n<p>All right. Well, thank you very much for being here.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:31]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> Thank you so much. This was awesome. It&#8217;s so fun to talk to with you.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:35]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah, it is fun. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:37]</span> <strong>Julia:</strong> Cool. Well, good luck. I hope you have a great rest of your day. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:40]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> You too. And that&#8217;s it for today&#8217;s episode.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Thanks for stopping by. I know that I&#8217;m pretty excited about all the different kinds of events that are coming, all the different places that we can go, and people we can meet, and different ways that we can interact and build things. Be sure to stop by tomorrow for the final episode of this <span>[00:29:00]</span> series.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Thu, 29 Feb 2024 16:24:58 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:14:\"Topher DeRosia\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:33;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:81:\"WPTavern: You Don’t Need to Know Code to Build a Successful WP Plugin Business.\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154486\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:88:\"https://wptavern.com/you-dont-need-to-know-code-to-build-a-successful-wp-plugin-business\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:19645:\"<p>With all the consolidation happening in the WordPress plugin ecosystem, it’s easy to think that it’d be futile to start your own WP plugin business.&nbsp; But the reality is that there are many small plugin developers making a living flying under the radar of the big dogs.</p>\n\n\n\n<ol><li><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/you-dont-need-to-know-code-to-build-a-successful-wp-plugin-business#as-valuable-as-1-big-project-per-year\">As Valuable as 1 Big Project Per Year</a></li><li><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/you-dont-need-to-know-code-to-build-a-successful-wp-plugin-business#building-shopwp-into-a-full-time-job\">Building ShopWP Into a Full-Time Job</a></li><li><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/you-dont-need-to-know-code-to-build-a-successful-wp-plugin-business#it-s-never-too-late-to-start-marketing-your-plugin\">It’s never too late to start marketing your plugin. </a></li><li><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/you-dont-need-to-know-code-to-build-a-successful-wp-plugin-business#you-don-t-need-to-know-code-to-build-a-successful-wp-plugin-business\">You don&#8217;t need to know code to build a successful WP plugin business.</a></li><li><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/you-dont-need-to-know-code-to-build-a-successful-wp-plugin-business#becoming-a-successful-plugin-developer-is-not-without-its-challenges\">Becoming a Successful Plugin Developer Is Not Without Its Challenges</a></li><li><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/you-dont-need-to-know-code-to-build-a-successful-wp-plugin-business#supporting-and-maintaining-wp-plugins-can-be-difficult\">Supporting and Maintaining WP Plugins Can Be Difficult </a></li><li><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/you-dont-need-to-know-code-to-build-a-successful-wp-plugin-business#don-t-forget-the-exit\">Don’t Forget the Exit</a></li><li><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/you-dont-need-to-know-code-to-build-a-successful-wp-plugin-business#you-ve-got-this\">You’ve Got This</a></li><li><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/you-dont-need-to-know-code-to-build-a-successful-wp-plugin-business#what-experiences-have-you-had-selling-wp-plugins-let-us-know-in-the-comments\">What Experiences Have You Had Selling WP Plugins? Let us know in the comments.</a></li><li><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/you-dont-need-to-know-code-to-build-a-successful-wp-plugin-business#related-links\">Related Links</a></li><li><a class=\"wp-block-table-of-contents__entry\" href=\"https://wptavern.com/you-dont-need-to-know-code-to-build-a-successful-wp-plugin-business#comments\">Comments ↓</a></li></ol>\n\n\n\n<img width=\"2560\" height=\"1707\" src=\"https://wptavern.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/02/kenny-eliason-dDvrIJbSCkg-unsplash-scaled.jpg\" alt=\"Laptop computer on a desk with a brick wall behind it. Dollar bills are laying around the laptop.\" class=\"wp-image-154507\" />Photo by <a href=\"https://unsplash.com/photos/macbook-pro-dDvrIJbSCkg\">Kenny Eliason</a>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"as-valuable-as-1-big-project-per-year\">As Valuable as 1 Big Project Per Year</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Barbara Schendel-Kent didn’t start out looking to become a plugin developer, but she now runs a successful plugin business that supplements her WP consulting income.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>4 years ago, Schendel hired a freelance developer to code the initial iteration of her popular Beaver Builder Mega Menu plugin for a client site.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“I needed a specific plugin, and it didn&#8217;t exist,” says Schendel-Kent of how she got into the plugin business. After activating the plugin on her client’s website, she asked the developer to round out the plugin’s functionality to get it ready to sell on her own website. Overall, it’s been a big win for Schendel-Kent.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“Beaver Builder Mega Menu has continued to bring in one big project’s worth of revenue every year,” she says. That’s significant for a plugin that requires very little upkeep.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>&#8220;It was an accident and very much an experiment,” added Schendel-Kent. “I was surprised by how few problems there were in the beginning.&nbsp; Most of the support requests were feature requests, not bugs.”</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"building-shopwp-into-a-full-time-job\">Building ShopWP Into a Full-Time Job</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>It took 6 years of intensive work, but ShopWP developer, Andrew Robbins, is finally at a point where his WordPress-to-Shopify connector plugin is making enough money to support his family, including purchasing a home to live in.&nbsp; Additionally, as his plugin’s success has grown, so have his ambitions.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“I want ShopWP to be a direct competitor with WooCommerce, even though I&#8217;m nowhere near their market share yet,” says Robbins.&nbsp; “I see ShopWP as empowering small business owners &#8211; giving them a beautiful and powerful online shop that rivals their larger competitors.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Another successful plugin developer takes a more modest approach and points out some struggles small plugin businesses encounter.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“It has become difficult to reach new clients who are overwhelmed by the tens of thousands of plugins available,” says Milan Petrovic, a developer who makes the bulk of his living selling his WP plugins on his website, Dev4Press.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“Big companies can pour a lot of money into advertising…It is almost impossible to find websites that have honest, not-paid-for reviews of premium plugins,” adds Petrovic. “The chance of ending up with a bad plugin [based on reviews on a website] is quite high.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>However, some plugin business owners see lots of opportunities for small businesses to promote their plugins.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“Having a free plugin in WP.org is a great place to start,” says Jesse Sutherland, an app and plugin developer who successfully sold 2 WP plugins in 2023. “For example, if you link back to your website from your wp.org page, that’s a valuable link.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Not to say it’s easy, as you might need to stretch your marketing muscles to make it work for your specific business.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“Before embarking on writing the plugins I sold last year, I did do some keyword research to make sure this was a plugin people were looking for,” Sutherland says.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Additionally, there are ways to outmaneuver the big players.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“Getting on some of the ‘Top 10 List’ sites is helpful, even if it’s a ‘You scratch my back, I scratch yours’ thing or maybe a thing where you trade links.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Sometimes paying is the best way to get your brand out, but you don’t need to spend millions of dollars.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“Paying to get listed on a ‘Top 10’ website or developing a partnership deal or affiliate program are great ways to get people interested in buying your plugin,” Sutherland adds.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<img width=\"1536\" height=\"1152\" src=\"https://wptavern.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/02/marketing.jpg\" alt=\"Stickers of WordPress from WordCamp Asia & WordCamp Sylhet\" class=\"wp-image-154514\" />Photo by <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/photos/photo/111647dbab/\">Mohammad Adil morshed</a>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"it-s-never-too-late-to-start-marketing-your-plugin\">It’s never too late to start marketing your plugin.&nbsp;</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>“I&#8217;ve worked on ShopWP for around 6 years, and I&#8217;m just now implementing some level of product marketing,” Robbins says. “It&#8217;s not even that I was unaware of the importance of doing it; it was pure procrastination.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Robbins has also been able to increase revenue for his business through strategic price increases.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“I raised my prices in 2021 and, to my surprise, people didn&#8217;t bat an eye,” Robbins says. “Not only did this help me grow ShopWP, but it was a psychological relief to know that people were still willing to purchase my product, even at the elevated price.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Sometimes you just get lucky when you create something good.&nbsp; The aforementioned Beaver Builder Mega Menu plugin garnered some unexpected praise and a P.R. boost from the official <em>Beaver Builder</em> website.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>&#8220;Beaver Builder created a special blog post on their site with a video walkthrough with how to use my plugin,” the plugin’s owner, Schendel-Kent says.&nbsp; “This was such a compliment that they not only spent the time to write the article but also to create the video.&nbsp; I didn&#8217;t even ask them to!&nbsp; That was validating.”</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"you-don-t-need-to-know-code-to-build-a-successful-wp-plugin-business\">You don&#8217;t need to know code to build a successful WP plugin business.</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Surprisingly, Schendel didn’t write any of the initial code for Beaver Builder Mega Menu, and over the years, “99% of the code was written by other developers,” she says.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“Maybe you write no code, but you&#8217;ve got a decent bedside manner and business sense,” Schendel says. “You don&#8217;t need to be a coder to write and sell a plugin.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Alternatively, you could be the primary developer of a plugin and transition out of that role. Vova Feldman, who runs Freemius, a sass service that takes care of the e-commerce and licensing parts of selling WP plugins, started out writing the code for his nascent platform, however, as the years passed, he moved into a non-coding role.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“Our team has grown to 20 passionate individuals, and my role has evolved dramatically,” Feldman says. “Coding has taken a backseat to facilitating communication, coaching our team, recruiting new talent, and engaging with partners.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“It’s been a reminder that making oneself ‘redundant’ is not a step back but a leap towards a future where everyone shines brighter together,” Feldman says of his business’ journey.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Making himself ‘redundant’ allowed Feldman to do something that many business owners dream of: taking personal time.&nbsp; “Taking time off for a vacation or parental leave, which I did last March when I welcomed my baby boy into the world, is no longer a source of stress,” Feldman says.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"becoming-a-successful-plugin-developer-is-not-without-its-challenges\">Becoming a Successful Plugin Developer Is Not Without Its Challenges</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>“The first major difference I noticed early on was the uncertainty,” says Robbins of his ShopWP plugin business early on. “With consulting work, being paid was never really in question. My customers were largely business owners or larger companies, and the income was very predictable.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>For years Robbins continued earning the bulk of his revenue consulting while working on ShopWP on the side.&nbsp; This was done simply because, at first, ShopWP didn’t earn living wage revenue.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“The early years of ShopWP were basically the opposite [of the consulting business]. ShopWP’s income was rare and unpredictable,” he says. “Even when a sale came through, I had to deal with the looming uncertainty of issuing refunds.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“However, now that ShopWP has matured a bit, the income is both predictable and provides even more freedom than the consulting work,” adds Robbins. “So it&#8217;s definitely a long-term investment that (hopefully) continues to pay off.”</p>\n\n\n\n<img width=\"2560\" height=\"1709\" src=\"https://wptavern.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/02/ilya-pavlov-OqtafYT5kTw-unsplash-scaled.jpg\" alt=\"A laptop screen with lots of code on it.\" class=\"wp-image-154513\" />Photo by <a href=\"https://unsplash.com/photos/monitor-showing-java-programming-OqtafYT5kTw\">Ilya Pavlov</a>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"supporting-and-maintaining-wp-plugins-can-be-difficult\">Supporting and Maintaining WP Plugins Can Be Difficult&nbsp;</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>“One of the biggest challenges with developing plugins for the WordPress community is that you have so little control over the server environments where your code will live,” says Natalie MacLees, COO and founder of N², which sells the <em>Simply Schedule Appointments</em> and <em>Draw Attention</em> WP plugins.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“There are potentially multiple versions of PHP, different MySQL setups, all kinds of different server configurations, and thousands of different plugins and themes with which you need to make sure your code is compatible,” MacLees says. “It’s really challenging as a small company to have the bandwidth and budget to do extensive testing for all of these different variables.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The potential problems grow as your plugin’s reach expands.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“Early on, when our plugins had less than 100 active installs, the potential impact of releasing a bug or a poorly implemented feature was pretty small,” MacLees says. “But once our plugins became more popular and had tens of thousands of active installs, the potential impact of a bug became a lot greater and could easily overwhelm our support team and leave us with a lot of unhappy customers who are in need of urgent fixes.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>What happens when you are the only developer of a plugin and you need to take a sick day?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“If I get sick and can&#8217;t work for three days, I&#8217;ll usually lose about a week&#8217;s worth of time to getting caught up with customer support,” says Robbins.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Also, adding to plugin developer workload, expectations around web accessibility seem to be increasing as the Americans with Disabilities Act and similar legislation is applied to websites &#8211; and as more and more lawyers get involved in suing businesses large and small. For example, both <em>Target</em> and <em>Domino&#8217;s Pizza</em> lost website-related ADA lawsuits recently.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>WordPress consultant, Matt Christenson, recently helped a business resolve some web accessibility issues related to an ADA compliance lawsuit.&nbsp; He shares a recent story where, even with the best of intentions and efforts to bring a website into ADA compliance, a company was the target of an ADA compliance lawsuit.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“An ADA compliance lawsuit is a major headache,” Christenson says.&nbsp; “One client of mine had to hire an attorney and another developer &#8211; hundreds of hours were invested &#8211; it was a bad situation all around.”&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>But that doesn’t mean you should shy away from plugin development due to web accessibility concerns.&nbsp; Christensen says web accessibility skills are learnable and will work their way into your workflow with some education and diligence.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“It takes a bit more research on the front end to educate yourself about the WCAG compliance criteria,” Christenson says while expressing that the bulk of web accessibility problems are common and correctable. “For example, font icons need a ‘role=’ tag on them,” he says.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Bringing your plugin into reasonable compliance with ADA guidelines doesn’t need to be overwhelming or break the bank.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Web accessibility consultant and member of the Make WordPress Accessible team, Joe Dolson, recently <a href=\"https://themightymo.com/why-is-web-accessibility-important/\">simplified web accessibility basics into 3 simple points</a> that can fit on a 3&#215;5 card:&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<ol>\n<li>“<strong>Everything needs a name that describes what it does.</strong> If you have a link, the text should make it clear where that link goes. If you have a button, it should have text that clearly indicates what happens. Labels, alternative text, aria-label attributes – all methods of providing an accessible name.</li>\n\n\n\n<li><strong>Use native elements for interaction. </strong>Buttons should be ‘button’ or ‘input’. Links should be ‘a href=”‘. Building an accordion? Put a button inside a heading; don’t just add a click event to the heading.&nbsp;</li>\n\n\n\n<li><strong>Use HTML to structure your documents. </strong>Headings are there for a reason: they provide an outline of your document and give context for the following content. Don’t just use a heading because you want large text.”</li>\n</ol>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"don-t-forget-the-exit\">Don’t Forget the Exit</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>In addition to making money while you run a WP plugin business, there are potential earnings for you on the back end as well &#8211; the potential to sell your business.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Entrepreneur and app developer, Jesse Sutherland, successfully developed and sold 2 WP themes and 2 WP plugins over the last few years.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“The process of selling the WP themes and plugins was pretty smooth,” Sutherland said.&nbsp; “I think both parties were happy, and I would do it again.”</p>\n\n\n\n<img width=\"2048\" height=\"1365\" src=\"https://wptavern.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/02/heart-key.jpg\" alt=\"Computer key cap with a pixel-art heart on a wooden table.\" class=\"wp-image-154509\" />Photo by <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/photos/photo/29565c512f/\">Nilo Velez</a>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"you-ve-got-this\">You’ve Got This</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>WP plugin business owners mostly seem to find the experience of developing a WP plugin to be worthwhile and valuable.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“My favorite part of running a WordPress business is being able to cultivate and grow something of my own,” says Robbins. “I get to work on a codebase that I enjoy every day, and the only people I have to answer to are my customers. That&#8217;s a very rewarding feeling.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>&#8220;I&#8217;m most proud that it took off, that it&#8217;s self-sustaining, that it didn&#8217;t start on fire and implode,” Schendel concluded, only a little bit tongue-in-cheek.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"what-experiences-have-you-had-selling-wp-plugins-let-us-know-in-the-comments\">What Experiences Have You Had Selling WP Plugins? Let us know in the comments.</h2>\n\n\n\n<p></p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"related-links\">Related Links</h2>\n\n\n\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/geekwap/\">Matt Christenson</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/joedolson/\">Joe Dolson</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/svovaf/\">Vova Feldman</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/nataliemac/\">Natalie MacLees</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/gdragon/\">Milan Petrovic</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/andrewmrobbins/\">Andrew Robbins</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://wordpress.tv/speakers/barbara-schendel/\">Barbara Schendel-Kent</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/accessibility/\">Make WordPress Accessible team</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://bbmegamenu.com/\">Beaver Builder Mega Menu</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://wpshop.io/\">ShopWP</a></li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://freemius.com/\">Freemius</a></li>\n</ul>\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-post-author-biography\">Toby Cryns is a freelance CTO, WordPress consultant, and teacher at <a href=\"https://themightymo.com/\">The Mighty Mo! Design Co.</a> in Minneapolis, MN, USA.</div>\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"comments\">Comments ↓</h2>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Thu, 29 Feb 2024 13:38:42 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:10:\"Toby Cryns\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:34;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:75:\"WPTavern: Avada WordPress Theme Patches Arbitrary File Upload Vulnerability\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154496\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:86:\"https://wptavern.com/avada-wordpress-theme-patches-arbitrary-file-upload-vulnerability\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:1836:\"<p>ThemeFusion’s multipurpose WordPress theme <a href=\"https://themeforest.net/item/avada-responsive-multipurpose-theme/2833226\">Avada</a> has patched an Arbitrary File Upload Vulnerability. Avada is one of ThemeForest&#8217;s most popular premium themes with nearly 950k sales.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>This vulnerability was reported responsibly by Muhammad Zeeshan (Xib3rR4dAr) during <a href=\"https://www.wordfence.com/blog/2024/02/2751-bounty-awarded-for-arbitrary-file-upload-vulnerability-patched-in-avada-wordpress-theme/\">Wordfence</a>’s Bug Bounty Extravaganza earning him $2,751. The researchers have categorized it as a &#8220;high severity&#8221; concern, with a CVSS score of 8.8, and strongly recommend updating the theme.</p>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p>The Avada | Website Builder For WordPress &amp; WooCommerce theme for WordPress is vulnerable to arbitrary file uploads due to missing file type validation in the ajax_import_options() function in all versions up to, and including, 7.11.4. This makes it possible for authenticated attackers, with contributor-level access and above, to upload arbitrary files on the affected site’s server which may make remote code execution possible<strong>.</strong></p>\n<cite>-Wordfence</cite></blockquote>\n\n\n\n<p>The nature of the vulnerability allows attackers to upload arbitrary malicious PHP code and remotely execute code on the server. Even if the uploaded file is removed, attackers can still upload multiple large files as there is no restriction on the file extensions.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Muhammad Zeeshan contacted the ThemeFusion team on February 6, and a patched version of the theme was released on February 12. We urge all Avada users to immediately update their websites to the latest version of the theme 7.11.5.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Thu, 29 Feb 2024 13:14:12 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:7:\"Jyolsna\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:35;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:124:\"Do The Woo Community: WordPress Translation, Internationalization, and Documentation with Estela Rueda &amp; Pascal Birchler\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:28:\"https://dothewoo.io/?p=79155\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:77:\"https://dothewoo.io/wordpress-translation-internationalization-documentation/\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:475:\"<p>A chat about global accessibility through WordPress translation efforts, upcoming 6.5 improvements and the community\'s cultural emphasis</p>\n<p>&gt;&gt; The post <a href=\"https://dothewoo.io/wordpress-translation-internationalization-documentation/\">WordPress Translation, Internationalization, and Documentation with Estela Rueda &#038; Pascal Birchler</a> appeared first on <a href=\"https://dothewoo.io\">Do the Woo - a WooCommerce and WordPress Builder Podcast</a>	.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Thu, 29 Feb 2024 10:00:00 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:5:\"BobWP\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:36;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:73:\"WPTavern: Data Liberation: Meet WordPress.org’s Ambitious Plan for 2024\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154463\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:80:\"https://wptavern.com/data-liberation-meet-wordpress-orgs-ambitious-plan-for-2024\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:13746:\"<p>“Imagine a more open web where people can switch between any platform of their choosing. A web where being locked into a system is a thing of the past. This is the web I’ve always wanted to see.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>At the end of his <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/state-of-the-word/\">State of the Word 2023</a> keynote, Matt Mullenweg pulled a Steve Jobs move, revealing Data Liberation, an initiative he described as the thing he’s most excited about.</p>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p><em>“In 2024, we want to unlock the web through a dedicated focus on migration tools. We want to make first-party community plugins, tools, and workflows available o</em>n <em>WordPress.org [&#8230;] I want it to be seamless, straightforward, and as zero friction as possible.”</em></p>\n</blockquote>\n\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-embed__wrapper\">\n\n</div>\n\n\n\n<p>Mullenweg promised that WordPress.org would take these projects under its wings, provide each with a dedicated Slack channel and GitHub repository on its official platforms, and ensure a swift review process of about one business day.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"https://wordpress.org/news/2024/01/data-liberation-in-2024/\">In a post published</a> shortly after the event, Mullenweg laid an even more ambitious plan:</p>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p><em>“Migrating your site to WordPress, or exporting all your content from WordPress, should be possible in one click. I want WordPress’ export format to become the lingua franca of CMSes, whether coming to WordPress or moving within WordPress.</em></p>\n\n\n\n<p><em>[&#8230;] it should be more than plugins; workflows, tutorials, and helper scripts should be shared, too. I want this resource to have space to include moving from social networks, moving from a page builder to core blocks, switching from classic to blocks, and improving WordPress current canonical plugins for importing.”</em></p>\n</blockquote>\n\n\n\n<p></p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">We’ve Only Just Begun</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>There’s a lot of work: the guides on the <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/data-liberation/\">Data Liberation website</a> are mostly outlines, <a href=\"https://github.com/WordPress/data-liberation\">waiting for contributors</a> to materialize the team’s good intentions. The recently updated <a href=\"https://developer.wordpress.org/advanced-administration/wordpress/import/\">Importing Content</a> guide on the WordPress Developer Resources website includes obsolete services and links.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Navigate to <strong>Tools</strong> &gt; <strong>Import</strong>, and you’ll get a similar blast from the past looking at the importing tools on offer: Blogger, LiveJournal, Movable Type and TypePad. If you have a website hosted on WordPress.com, you’ll get support for a handful of contemporary platforms, including Medium, Squarespace, Substack, and Wix.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Contributors made a little spring clean in 2021, moving the code of these and other somewhat relevant importers from SVN <a href=\"https://github.com/WordPress?q=importer&type=all&language=&sort=\">to GitHub</a>, where it’s easier to maintain. But that’s barely scratching the surface.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>What’s needed now is traction.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Calling All Hosting Companies</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>In a post titled <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2024/02/19/data-liberation-next-steps/\">Data Liberation Next Steps</a>, project leader Jordan Gillman introduced a few high-level paths forward:</p>\n\n\n\n<ul>\n<li>A proposal to <a href=\"https://github.com/WordPress/data-liberation/discussions/53\">use Playground as a migration tool</a>.</li>\n\n\n\n<li>A <a href=\"https://github.com/WordPress/data-liberation/discussions/55\">hybrid approach</a> that involves auto-detecting the source platform and guiding users through the process.</li>\n\n\n\n<li>A discussion about <a href=\"https://github.com/WordPress/data-liberation/discussions/56\">improvements to WXR (WordPress eXtended RSS)</a>.</li>\n</ul>\n\n\n\n<p>There are still no concrete timelines and not everybody in the community is thrilled, but we decided to reach out to Gillman to get some more answers.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>What’s the current status of the project?</strong><br />“There’s been a conversation about how to approach data liberation across teams. I’m hoping to bring those conversations together to brainstorm and more concretely plan what the project actually looks like.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Broadly speaking, the response has been really positive. However, getting buy-in from plugin developers and other stakeholders will continue to be a priority for this project. The first initial challenge is one of coordination; this is going to be a collaborative project (by design), which means drawing folks and companies together to define the path forward.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I’ll be at WordCamp Asia next week, and look forward to chatting with folks in person!”</p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Are there plans to collaborate with other online platforms (open source or commercial) to promote this initiative and make it a reality? I imagine a utopian scenario where WordPress leadership sits down with major players in the industry to create a standard—something<a href=\"https://wordpress.org/news/2023/08/concerns-over-the-european-unions-cyber-resilience-act-cra/\"> along the lines of the efforts made in the case of the EU’s Cyber Resilience Act</a>.</strong><br />“Data Liberation could be an opportunity to lead by example. And since WordPress is doing this publicly, anyone can share updates about this work. That really means that how we go about this project today needs to be with that broader picture in mind.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Have you considered starting with a universal content migration solution instead of the more ambitious data objective?</strong><br />“At this stage, the focus is on addressing the goal of migrating sites to WordPress or exporting all content from WordPress in one click, thus simplifying the process of transferring content between platforms.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>In terms of ‘universal’ content migration, I think conversations about the WXR Import/Export format are really valuable. I’m also excited about the potential of<a href=\"https://wordpress.org/playground/\"> WordPress Playground</a>, which uses a ZIP file for migrations.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>It&#8217;s important to note that this is an ongoing project and that these efforts don&#8217;t exclude bigger goals related to &#8216;data.&#8217; They provide a tangible starting point, with small, achievable phases to actively involve contributors in progressing toward our broader goals.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>You ended the post with questions. How would you answer the last two?</strong></p>\n\n\n\n<ul>\n<li><strong>With such a broad scope, what should be focused on with the highest priority?</strong><br />“One thing that I’m particularly excited about is pulling the disparate plugins, guides, and tools and unifying them in an interface to simplify the experience for users in the migration process. A user shouldn’t have to go searching for the right tool (or combination of tools); we should be able to direct them to the appropriate solution, and walk them through the process!”<br /></li>\n\n\n\n<li><strong>What other voices should be heard on this topic?</strong><br />“I hope that this question prompts voices from individuals and groups that I haven&#8217;t already thought of. I&#8217;m also keen to hear from web hosts. Given their daily management of migrations for customers, I believe they have insights into pain points, popular platforms (and how they could help), and valuable tools and workarounds that could benefit the wider community.”</li>\n</ul>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Radical Ethos</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Manton Reece, the creator of Micro.blog, recently wrote about why and how he uses <em>Blog Archive format (.bar)</em>, a format<a href=\"https://www.manton.org/2017/11/24/blog-archive-format.html\"> he developed in 2017</a>, hoping it would become universal. Apparently, Dave Winer, co-author of the RSS format, <a href=\"https://cagrimmett.com/micro/aa2835f451/#comment-34471\">had similar ideas</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>During the keynote, Mullenweg made clear that more than a technical vision, Data Liberation is an ethical commitment. “Data Liberation is not just about building the tools, it’s about cultivating a community ethos.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"https://wordpress.org/news/2023/01/letter-from-wordpress-executive-director-2022/\">Josepha Haden Chomphosy</a>, the Executive Director of the WordPress project, expressed a similar sentiment in her post-event letter:</p>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p><em>“There’s an extent to which the idea of owning your content and data online is a radical idea. Securing an open web for the future is, I believe, a net win for the world especially when contrasted to the walled gardens and proprietary systems that pit us all against one another with the purpose of gaining more data to sell.”</em></p>\n</blockquote>\n\n\n\n<p>Their words echo core contributor Gary Pendergast’s moral obligation to web users from 2021.<a href=\"https://pento.net/2021/01/18/wordpress-importers-stating-the-problem/\"> In a 4-part series</a>, Pendergast draws a neat circle around the open web advocates’ shared visions: he explores the history of a category of tools he calls WordPress Importers, outlines the problems, and eventually shares a solution:<a href=\"https://github.com/pento/free-as-in-speech\"> An experimental browser extension</a> that exports data from Wix using its API.</p>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p><em>“Some services [&#8230;] don’t allow you to export your own content. Other services provide incomplete or fragmented exports, needlessly forcing stress upon site owners [&#8230;]</em></p>\n\n\n\n<p><em>When a CMS actively works against providing such freedom to their community, I would argue that we have an obligation to help that community out.</em></p>\n\n\n\n<p><em>WordPress doesn’t exist in a vacuum, we’re part of a broad ecosystem which can only exist through the web remaining open and free. By encouraging all CMSes to provide proper exports, and implementing them for those that don’t, we help keep our ecosystem healthy.”</em></p>\n</blockquote>\n\n\n\n<p>Between rescuing users from vendor lock-in and fostering a healthy ecosystem, <a href=\"http://wordpress.org/\">WordPress.org</a> is in a perfect position to take the lead on such an undertaking and support, fund, and promote it.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Software Can Do that</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>With the philosophical problems out of the way and the potential to solve the commercial ones on the horizon, we’re left with the technical issues.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The primary pain point of WXR is the lack of media support, but once you start considering newer tech stacks, this suddenly seems like the least of everyone’s problems.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Let’s present these players:</p>\n\n\n\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https://w3techs.com/technologies/overview/content_management\">W3Tech places</a> WordPress (43.2%), Shopify (4.3%), and Wix (2.6%) as the top three most used CMSs.</li>\n\n\n\n<li>BuiltWith’s dataset shows that Webflow is number 15 on the list of CMS used across the <a href=\"https://trends.builtwith.com/cms\">top 1 million sites crawled</a>, and Contentful is number 26.</li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://webtechsurvey.com/technology-type/headless-cms\">WebTechSurvey’s analysis</a> reports that 42,900 of the 31,758,591 websites that use a CMS opt for headless CMS, with Ghost leading the market (41.05%).</li>\n</ul>\n\n\n\n<p>Buzzing with hype, these tools that many—not just younger—developers are touting are almost missing from the project’s repository. So far, it hasn’t attracted interest from people working with headless CMSs like Ghost, Sanity, or Prismic.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Trendy site builders, like Webflow or Storyblok, steadily gaining traction among product-oriented teams, are also absent. Less restrictive than their predecessors, they share their mean inclination to make it harder to move away.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Migrating to and from these new platforms presents new challenges, including mapping custom schemas and supporting discrete file types (RSS/XML, JSON, CSV, markdown, HTML).</p>\n\n\n\n<p>None of that is impossible to resolve; that’s what software is for. But there is one more obstacle: the knowledge gap between those who possess a deep understanding of Gutenberg, its architecture, and design principles, and all the others, including some core contributors and plugin developers.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>In an interesting <a href=\"https://wordpress.slack.com/archives/C069AKUBPHB/p1702439016569189\">discussion on the project’s Slack channel</a>, Automattic’s Software Design Engineer, Dennis Snell, demonstrated how invaluable it is to keep this initiative as collaborative and wide-reaching as possible.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Thank You For Choosing WordPress</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>These are still early days, but the Data Liberation initiative is a rare political act, and how the platform’s leadership frames it is inspiring.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>When billion-dollar corporations gobble up as much data as they can store on their servers, it’s almost defiant to invest time and money in making it easier for people to do with their data—their business, their thoughts—as they wish.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Information, generated by these bits of data and serving as the foundation of knowledge, doesn’t want to be free. It’s us, humans, who want that. Let’s do something about it.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Wed, 28 Feb 2024 22:27:37 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:11:\"Ronny Shani\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:37;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:85:\"WPTavern: WordPress Photo Festival 2024, A Five Part Retrospective, Part 3, Attendees\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154469\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:93:\"https://wptavern.com/wordpress-photo-festival-2024-a-five-part-retrospective-part-3-attendees\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:42681:\"<p>In this episode we interview three attendees, one in India, one in Spain, and one in the USA. We have a great conversation about what it means to &#8220;attend&#8221; a virtual event, and ways we could make it more engaging for those that wish it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>In this particular we’ll meet attendees Hari, Nilo, and Jeff.</strong></p>\n\n\n\n<p>This article is available in Video, Audio, and transcribed text.</p>\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n<p>Audio version:</p>\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Transcription:</h2>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:00:00]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Hi,</p>\n\n\n\n<p>welcome back to our series on the international photos festival that took place earlier this month in February, 2024. In this episode, we&#8217;re going to talk to some attendees about what their experience was taking part in the event, getting photos uploaded and understanding how it all works. So if you could tell me your full name and where you live.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:00:44]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> My name is Aishankar and I live in Kochi, India, which is in the southern part of India in a city called Kerala. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:00:51]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> All right. So you were near the center of all the action, right? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:00:56]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> Yes. Yes. I saw, yes, I was, I was, I&#8217;ve <span>[00:01:00]</span> been in the center of the action, literally and figuratively. So definitely. So, because I live in the center of Kerala as well.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So yes. Okay. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:09]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> So, um, I want to talk to you because you were an attendee and there must surely have been a wide variety of kinds of attendees because there are some people who are far away by themselves. Others were in a group. Um, what? Okay, first of all, how many photos did you submit? One? A hundred?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:33]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> Somewhere closer to one than hundred, but if I can give you the exact number, exactly nine photos, if memory serves me right. I submitted ten, one got rejected, so nine </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:42]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> were approved. So in Kochi, in Kerala, were there groups of people who went out and did photo walks? Or was it all singles everywhere? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:56]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> I believe we had folks contributing single photos.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:02:00]</span> Uh, But as, as a local community, we did have photo walks before the photo festival event, which were held by local meetups, especially the Cori code meetup. So those folks went on photo walks and they&#8217;ve had a couple of events where they did it. But for this event specifically, I don&#8217;t think there were photo walks.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Mostly we had folks contributing photos individually. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:02:22]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Sure. That&#8217;s very interesting. I would have expected, um, people to get together because, uh, sort of, sort of put together by your community. Yes, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:02:31]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> it was an idea that was floated though, but this was mostly an online event. We, uh, there was, there was some talks of having local events, local in person, um, gatherings to contribute photos, but due to the logistic side of things.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Online mates made more sense, especially for this event. So we had folks trying to do it online, but it does sound like a great idea to have an in person aspect to this community building, especially for an online global event. So for the next photo <span>[00:03:00]</span> festival, I&#8217;m pretty sure there&#8217;s going to be an in person part of it and photo walks and all that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:03:04]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> So if you do that, do me a favor. Get everyone into a group and take their, a group photo with their back to the camera. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:03:13]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> Ooh. There&#8217;s a, then you can put it up on the project. That would be nice. Uh, there&#8217;s actually a very famous, one of the, one of the most famous Bollywood movies, which has a scene like this where like the three protagonists, so they&#8217;re like three musketeers.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Like they show their backs to the camera. There&#8217;s an iconic photo. Uh, the movie is called three idiots. So, yeah, we&#8217;re going to do that like a bunch of open source lovers, you know, showing their backs to the camera so they can be on, they can be on the directory. That&#8217;s a fantastic idea. I would love to do that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:03:48]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> So, uh, for your, for your photos for this, did you take new custom photos for this event or did you select some out of your library? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:03:57]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> I, to be honest with you, I did select some out of my <span>[00:04:00]</span> library. So I&#8217;m in a very unique situation. I, I take a lot of photos for myself, which I do not share elsewhere. Like I used to, but then like, I just take photos as a, how do I say it?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Like for my own reference or just to read a memory. You know, I just keep going back to it. Yes. So I had a, I was, I&#8217;ve been sitting on a, um, I&#8217;m, I&#8217;m sitting on a stash of at least 200, 000 photos. So I have, I have plenty of them. And it so happens that a lot of them meet our guidelines as well. So I just had to go back and 2023 was a year, 2022, 23.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I traveled a lot. And as you know, we&#8217;ve been together on at least a couple of those trips. So I, and I had a chance to take photos all over the world. So my photos reflect my travels. So you will, you will find photos from Kerala, Singapore, the U. S., Europe, right? Literally Japan, like you, you&#8217;ll see a side of the slice of the world in the nine photos that I contributed as part of the photo festival and my <span>[00:05:00]</span> other contributions in the past as well.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:05:02]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> I experienced that with Bigel as well after, uh, I think after WordCamp Asia. Yes. He went on a world tour. It would seem. Yes. He posted pictures from Serbia and Romania. And I&#8217;m like, yeah, don&#8217;t you live in India? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:05:20]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> Yeah. He, he, he is also sitting on a very similar, but actually much bigger stats than I. So I wouldn&#8217;t be surprised.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:05:29]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. He recently passed me. The person with the most photos up there. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:05:33]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> I did see that. I did see that. So interesting. , </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:05:37]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> he&#8217;s, he&#8217;s the man. . Yes. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:05:39]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> So are you, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:05:40]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> okay, so no, there can only be one. It&#8217;s like, no, I, I, I </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:05:45]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> think that&#8217;s space for multiple. We have, we have no project so we, we can have as many people as, yes. So, okay.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:05:51]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Um, so you were an attendee of this event, but what, practically <span>[00:06:00]</span> speaking, that sounds like you sat at your desk and uploaded nine photos. Uh, which is not a, not a lot of time commitment, which is kind of nice. Um, what does it, what does it mean to be an attendee of an event where you can spend, I mean, you can upload five pictures at once.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So if you did just five pictures, you could literally be an attendee and a contributor and take part in the whole event in five minutes. That&#8217;s, that&#8217;s very different.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:06:31]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> I, I still found it fulfilling and my, my regret is that I could not upload a lot more. I could have actually, I just got busy with other things, but I, but I did enjoy it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>It was a very unique experience and I think it reflects a future of events where we don&#8217;t need to be in person synchronously at a certain for a certain amount of time to do it. So there&#8217;s other ways where you can collaborate collectively, which like, like this event where you sort of like upload photos and <span>[00:07:00]</span> then it shows up in the photo directory and like you&#8217;ve made it available for anybody to really use that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And, uh, I&#8217;m, I&#8217;m, I&#8217;m sure I can think of a, A hundred different scenarios that folks might find the photos that I&#8217;ve uploaded useful. So while it did, like you said, while it did take only five minutes for me, I didn&#8217;t feel the impact of it. You know, so, uh, I&#8217;ve not done this before and I feel, I felt part of the global WordPress community, which is why I keep contributing to WordPress.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>When I uploaded those photos in those five minutes, You know, and when those were approved, when I got the email notifications that they were approved, it didn&#8217;t feel good. Um, it does feel good. I, I, yes, I, I felt connected to the global community. I felt this very unique sense of belonging. I felt so loved and like, it was like, I was a part of this.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>This, you know, uh, a global community. I already am. Yeah. But it felt even more so. So that was this warm, fuzzy feeling, which I got in five minutes, which I may not <span>[00:08:00]</span> have got at a, at another event. If I attended an online event or maybe even at an in person WordCamp, this feeling of, you know, having those photos out there in five minutes, it felt good.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Definitely felt good. Yeah. Yes. Yes. To the warm, fuzzy feeling. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:08:14]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Similar, similar to being a code contributor, one line can change someone&#8217;s life. One photo can change someone&#8217;s project. Absolutely. If you get the perfect photo and it just fits. Yes. Um, that&#8217;s, that&#8217;s, that&#8217;s a really big deal. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:08:29]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> And, and it so happens that our photos are CC zero, which is the closest equivalent to GPL.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So he&#8217;s giving it out to the world. You&#8217;re, you&#8217;re just, you know, uh, maybe it&#8217;s a, it&#8217;s a blogger. They was looking for an image and this image fits for them or a company who was trying to, you know, create a corporate website. N number of uses and if it helps them that that that may that means the world for me So even if even if what one person uses a photo that i&#8217;ve used or maybe I mean it&#8217;s out there Even if others watch it that that that means the world to <span>[00:09:00]</span> me So I I didn&#8217;t have a few four people come into me and say hey those photos look good Which is a really good moment for me because I never consider myself to be a photographer.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Like I told you, I just take photos for my own reference. I&#8217;m not, I&#8217;ll be honest with you. I&#8217;m not a photographer, but when, when random people, to be honest, it&#8217;s not a lot. It&#8217;s not like they said, Oh, this is a breathtaking photo, but they just. When, when somebody shares a positive comment on a work that you&#8217;ve done it, that&#8217;s what we live for.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Right? Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Yes. We&#8217;re all human beings and we need that validation. So that validation definitely felt good. So yes, yes, to the, yes, to everything is to belonging is to warm, fuzzy feelings is to being part of a global community. Yes. Helping others. So </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:09:40]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> you heard it here, kids comment on blog posts.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:09:43]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> People like it. Yes, absolutely. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:09:49]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> All right. Um, so you did, you did nine photos. That was fulfilling. Was it fulfilling enough? If we do this again, are you, are you going to do more? Are you going to do less? <span>[00:10:00]</span> Are you happy with what you did? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:10:02]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> So, um, I was helping out with the, with the event and, um, I was obviously not looking for prices or anything.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I was just doing this for me, of course. That&#8217;s, that&#8217;s what, that&#8217;s why I can&#8217;t do it, but when I&#8217;m doing it, when I&#8217;m doing it for a different photo festival. I might get into the competitive spirit. I&#8217;m going to, I might, I want to win prizes, but just kidding. I&#8217;m just doing it for open source. I would definitely do more.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And I was definitely busier this time. So when the next event happens anywhere all over the world, I mean, that&#8217;s the beauty of this format, right? Anyone can organize it anywhere. It instantly, yes, it instantly becomes global. Which is, which is again the beauty of this format. So short answer to your question, yes, yes, and yes, I am, and I am going to be submitting way more photos than the nine ones that I did.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Because I have, I have, I have 200, 000 photos in my stash. So I need to, yeah, it would be a crime to not upload at least a hundred of them. So that&#8217;s right. I&#8217;m going to try doing </p>\n\n\n\n<p>that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:10:58]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Are you going to wait for the event, or are you going to start <span>[00:11:00]</span> soon? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:11:00]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> I, so in fact, like, uh, I did see someone in, uh, I think it was Jonathan, Jonathan Doroshes.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Somebody did pledge in Twitter that saying, who was saying that, Hey, I&#8217;m going to, I&#8217;m going to contribute like a photo periodically on a periodic basis. Yeah. So I&#8217;ve been, I&#8217;ve been doing that idea myself. I want to do that actually like, I mean, of course I, I will be a part of an event, but other than that, I want to, I want to do this regularly, you know, because like, um, I, and again, that, that feeling of getting that email that your photo is approved and, you know, putting your work out there, I wouldn&#8217;t do this consistently on a regular basis.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So yes, I am. I&#8217;m going to keep doing this. You will see more photos from me. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:11:40]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> That&#8217;s very exciting. I look forward to them. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:11:41]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> Yes, yes. I know you&#8217;re a moderator, so I&#8217;m going to make your life a little difficult by giving you more photos to moderate. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:11:49]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yep. Alright, well thank you very much for your time. This has been very enlightening.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Topher. And I will talk to you later. Being an international event is one of the things that <span>[00:12:00]</span> makes this event unique. Next we&#8217;re going to talk to Nilo from Spain. Thanks for coming today. Uh, tell me your name and where you&#8217;re from. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:12:09]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> Hello. Thank you for having me here. I&#8217;m Nilo Velez and I&#8217;m from, from Sevilla, Spain.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:12:15]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Oh, nice. Uh, I don&#8217;t know if you are closer to India in time than me or not. I don&#8217;t know what the offsets are. I </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:12:25]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> don&#8217;t know, because you&#8217;re maybe closer by one side. I&#8217;m closer on the other side. For me, it&#8217;s like seven hours. They are seven hours ahead from me. Something </p>\n\n\n\n<p>like </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:12:36]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> that. Oh, I think I&#8217;m 12. Yeah, so you&#8217;re closer.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So, uh, we&#8217;re here today to talk about the recent, uh, photos event that took place out of Kerala. Um, you&#8217;re in Spain. What made you think, Hey, look, an event in India. Let&#8217;s, let&#8217;s go do that. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:12:55]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> No, because I didn&#8217;t thought that it was an event in India. It was a <span>[00:13:00]</span> global event online. So from the photos, from the photos team.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So this time is in India, maybe next time is another place. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:13:09]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> All right. That&#8217;s, that&#8217;s actually really good to know because. They tried to convey that it is, it is an international event for all the organizers are mostly from Kerala. Yes. And so </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:13:19]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> they are been talking about the idea, you know, about making it, uh, more times in another hosting cities around the world.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:13:31]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. All right. Uh, and I&#8217;m, I&#8217;m sorry, you probably already said this. Where did you first see it?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:13:39]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> I don&#8217;t know. I think it was the photo channel on Slack. Okay. Yeah, probably was there. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:13:46]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Probably the first place they announced it. Um, so how many photos did you put in? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:13:54]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> I don&#8217;t remember. </p>\n\n\n\n<p>It was a hundred something maybe?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>No. No, no, no. No, <span>[00:14:00]</span> no, no. 80, 80 something. 83. Because the woman who won was 86. I was three photos, three photos behind her. Yeah. </p>\n\n\n\n<p>Wow. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:14:13]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Okay. Um, that&#8217;s quite a lot. Uh, for those. Okay. Watching, listening, and unaware. You can only, only, only upload five at a time until they get moderated. And so you have to wait. And particularly during this event, the wait was really quite long most days because there were just so many to do.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Um, how did you manage to get so many through? Get up early in the morning or? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:14:42]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> No. Okay. Now that I, this is over, I can tell my secret. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:14:46]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yes. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:14:48]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> No. Uh, okay. Uh, actually it was a hack on, uh, you know, hacking in a good way. I consider myself, myself a hack, a hacker, uh, not by <span>[00:15:00]</span> the idea of the pirate that breaks things, but, uh, to find the loopholes, find the tricks behind things.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And, uh, when the event was presented, uh, one of the moderators, uh, sold us. How the moderation, uh, QA works, right? I don&#8217;t remember if it was Michelle, maybe it was Michelle. Uh, and she said that, uh, when she moderate photos, uh, uh, you choose one of the photos from the QA and then, uh, the system automatically, uh, select another one random for you.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yes. So the trick is really easy is just to keep always five photos on the queue. Yes, because that way there&#8217;s more possibility of your photos get picked and moderated. Yep. And also they <span>[00:16:00]</span> say that the moderators have a problem because if the system flags an image, because it considers it violence, nudity, or whatever.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, the photo gets on hold, uh, because a super moderators have to, uh, go there and review that and remove the flag. And it was, uh, it happened a lot with animals. So no photos for animals. So if you, yes, send no photos for animals and keep five photos all the time, it&#8217;s more </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:16:34]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> problem probable that your photos </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:16:38]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> get approved.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:16:40]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah, that&#8217;s a good plan. Um, in the early days, I used to always keep five in the queue, but that&#8217;s because there are only three of us moderating and you can&#8217;t moderate your own. Well, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:16:52]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> those are not the early days. The early days were when, uh, Rocio Valdivia, uh, tell us, okay, we are <span>[00:17:00]</span> doing something new, </p>\n\n\n\n<p>which is going to be.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>A photo, something that they, they have sent me that they need photos. So you have been taking photos to WordCamp, so share, share that with us in this, uh, Google Drive album. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:17:17]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> That is a long time ago. Yeah. It&#8217;s been, it&#8217;s been years now, do you realize? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:17:22]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> Yeah. Yeah. I do now. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:17:25]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. Um, yeah. So. Uh, tell me about your photography, uh, do you have a, do you have a big camera or do you use a phone?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:17:37]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> I use several cameras, uh, I&#8217;m sorry. I&#8217;m a Sony shooter. I have been volunteering, volunteering as a photographer for a lot of work. Um, actually I work at my, uh, day job is as a developer and a translator. So this is more than a hobby, but you know, once you start going <span>[00:18:00]</span> to more and more work, you get a sponsor, you get a better year and you end up, uh, organizing the photography team or work on Europe, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:18:08]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> things happen.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>There you are. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:18:13]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> And there goes your impostor, your impostor syndrome, because you have, there&#8217;s one point in which you have to review the application for the volunteers, and you have to, to vet people who has been working as a professional photographer. For the press for 20 years or for the New York times, the National Geographic.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And you say, okay, I have to tell this guy how he has to take photos in a WordCamp. Okay. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:18:39]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah, that&#8217;s funny. Uh, so you&#8217;ve been around WordPress for a while doing photo photography for a while. Um, I, I have a compliment for you. Um, another moderator was, we were talking about, um, I think kind of deal with <span>[00:19:00]</span> people submitting too many photos that were.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Against the rules and someone said, Oh, but not, you know, he knows what he&#8217;s done. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:09]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> Yes, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:10]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> I actually take it a little personal when a photo of mine get rejected because, Oh, okay. That wasn&#8217;t, you cannot see the </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:19]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> face. You would have approved it. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:25]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> I don&#8217;t know. I don&#8217;t know if I, if I, one time I&#8217;m on the other side, I don&#8217;t know what the decision would have taken in moments like that, but yes, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:34]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> it hurts.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yeah, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:37]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> I know what you mean. I gave up, uh, I don&#8217;t want to say caring. I gave up feeling the sting long ago. I have, I don&#8217;t know, I&#8217;ve, I&#8217;ve a couple dozen rejected photos now. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:52]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> No, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:52]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> but, uh, actually that, uh, has been, it&#8217;s much better now because, uh, on the early <span>[00:20:00]</span> days when a photo gets, gets, uh, got rejected, they only say, uh, that we don&#8217;t accept your photo.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And now the moderators leave a comment saying okay we cannot accept that photo because there&#8217;s a face showing on the top right or there&#8217;s a logo so you can crop the photo or edit or whatever. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:20:22]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> That&#8217;s nice. Um, do you have any plans to do a photo event in New York City? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:20:31]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> I have already done now. Okay. A WordPress one?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I did, I did. Yeah. No, I, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:20:35]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> I did a, a WordPress photo walk during a WordPress meetup because I&#8217;m one of the organizer of the WordPress meetup group. Sure. And it went nice. We was like, uh, 10 foot photographers. I taught them how to contribute to the photo, the photo WordPress photo directory when taking photos and then they upload the song and it </p>\n\n\n\n<p>went great.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:20:58]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> I was talking with <span>[00:21:00]</span> Bigel in another interview and he said one of the issues they had with photo walks is that everybody takes a picture of the same thing. </p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yes, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:21:08]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> because you tend to go in a group and oh hey a plant, hey a plant, everyone takes a photo of a </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:21:14]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> plant, yeah. Yes, a bird, look get it. No, </p>\n\n\n\n<p>but we, we did, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:21:19]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> uh, we did that on Seville on Christmas night.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So there was a lot of lights, a lot of different, uh, photos to take. And when, you know, we, there was always that photo that everyone, everyone took, but, uh, for most of it, it was, it was nice. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:21:40]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> That&#8217;s really great. I think that&#8217;s all the questions I have for you. Um, really, I just wanted to know what you thought of being a participant in the event.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>You liked it? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:21:51]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> I like </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:21:51]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> it very much. The only thing that, uh, maybe I missed, uh, I, I don&#8217;t say this as a critic, not, uh, <span>[00:22:00]</span> just as, uh, something that should be, uh, taken into account for the other edition, that, uh, as a participant, I missed a little more communication during the event, because it was the opening event, the opening ceremony, the closing ceremony, the closing ceremony.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>that, uh, But during that, uh, you know, we try to get people into talk, um, uh, talking to the photos, uh, channel, but not so many people, uh, get involved, uh, on talk. So maybe, I don&#8217;t know, make, uh, some workshops or get, try to get people into the conversation. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:22:39]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Right. That&#8217;s, uh, that&#8217;s an excellent point. Um, and I know people who were involved in the organizing.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So. I&#8217;ll definitely pass that on. Um, a lot of people said they, well, I guess when I was talking to the volunteers, they said they didn&#8217;t feel the need for more <span>[00:23:00]</span> communication. They were able to just do their thing and move on. But that&#8217;s maybe it&#8217;s different from as a volunteer. Participant. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:23:11]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> Another thing that, uh, I don&#8217;t know, there&#8217;s something that, you know, you, that you have your opinion.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I have mine, but the fact that the prices about, uh, participation, uh, with actually when you have a, such a huge bottleneck, because, uh, if you say, okay, I&#8217;m giving you a price. If you submit the most photos, actually you are making more pressure The moderator that actually volunteers. So like, okay, you are going to work a lot this, uh, the, maybe the prices will, should have been to the </p>\n\n\n\n<p>moderator who actually, but </p>\n\n\n\n<p>they, it was you that was working during the event.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Not me. I was </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:23:57]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> sick. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:23:57]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Well, you are, you, it was, <span>[00:24:00]</span> it was, it was Michelle. Mostly Marcus was at a work camp. I was sick and Michelle. Moderated like 900 photos. That&#8217;s </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:24:10]</span> <strong>Nilo:</strong> just for you to share more on that </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:24:11]</span> <strong>Hari:</strong> word than me. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:24:12]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. Yeah. That&#8217;s actually an excellent point. All right. Well, thank you for your time. I appreciate it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Um, maybe I&#8217;ll see you, uh, at work camp Europe this year. We&#8217;ll see. We&#8217;ll try. All right. Our final interview of the day comes from Chicago, Illinois. Yet another international attendee. Thanks for being here today. Uh, tell us your name and where you&#8217;re from. Sure. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:24:44]</span> <strong>Jeff:</strong> Uh, Jeff Paul, director of open source at 10 up and I live in the Chicago area.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:24:51]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> All right. Um, there was a time when most of TENUP lived in the Portland area. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:24:58]</span> <strong>Jeff:</strong> Unofficial <span>[00:25:00]</span> headquarters. Yeah, we still have a good size contingent there, but not fully, fully distributed, fully remote, fully growable. Uh, so yeah, spread out for sure. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:25:10]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Nice. So we&#8217;re here today to talk about the, uh, international photos event that happened recently, and you are a participant.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>What does that mean? What does that mean to you? I&#8217;ve heard a number of things about what it means to be a participant in this thing. What does it mean to you to be a participant in that event? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:25:28]</span> <strong>Jeff:</strong> Yeah, I mean, it was, uh, I saw it as an opportunity to finally do something with the, like, tens of thousands of pictures I&#8217;ve taken with my, uh, camera phone over the years, right?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, never really printing many out, uh, only occasionally sending some to folks, uh, Infrequently posting to my own blog. So yeah, it was like, Oh, I can actually, you know, one contribute, uh, to the project, which is cool in a new way for me. And then also like make use of hopefully some photos, <span>[00:26:00]</span> um, mostly accepted, uh, at this point.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Excellent. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:26:05]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> That&#8217;s cool. Um, do you, you use a camera or </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:26:08]</span> <strong>Jeff:</strong> a phone? Primarily just a camera phone. So iPhone, whatever of the moment, uh, I think, I think my, the archive of things does include a camera, you know, back when. Yeah. The cameras on phones did not quite, uh, parallel the megapixels that you would get, but everything in like recent history is pretty much just the camera that&#8217;s, or the, the, sorry, the phone, um, yeah, not, not like a DSLR house over here by any means.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yeah, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:26:37]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> I don&#8217;t own a camera. I do it all on the phone. Uh, and if I did, I would struggle. Like I would take it on a photo walk, but most of my photos are very spontaneous and I&#8217;m not going to have my camera at a restaurant, walking down the street, whatever. And I think the vast majority of the photos on the project are camera phone.<span>[00:27:00]</span> </p>\n\n\n\n<p>So how did you hear about this event? What made you think? Hey, I&#8217;m going to go. Go do this thing. So </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:27:07]</span> <strong>Jeff:</strong> I, uh, I subscribe and follow the, uh, WordCamp Central, I think central. wordcamp. org, uh, just to be alerted when there&#8217;s new camps that come up, uh, usually to see if it&#8217;s one I want to try and attend. Uh, and this one came up as, uh, you know, it was unusual in that it wasn&#8217;t your typical WordCamp.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>It&#8217;s, you know, one of these kind of newer events that are being, uh, trialed now. And, uh, Seemed like an easy thing to contribute to. Um, the part participation part was a little more difficult &#8217;cause I think it was mainly hosted out of, um, India and the Indian time zone, and so I don&#8217;t have a great overlap there.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Um, so it was more of like a solo effort and not really as much of a community feel, <span>[00:28:00]</span> uh, on my end. But, uh, yeah, caught it from Word Camp Central. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:04]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Uh, I&#8217;m all right. It&#8217;s a good place. I&#8217;m finding that, uh, it was a very solitary event for most people. Um, Ari was on earlier and he said he picked five photos and sat down and uploaded them and he was done.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And that&#8217;s the extent, I mean, he did, he did nine total. So he did that maybe twice, but, uh, just a few minutes in a, in a week long event to be a participant. But then he also pointed out that the results of those few minutes are going to last. Right. You know, those photos are right out there for anybody to use forever.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, so that&#8217;s, that&#8217;s kind of a cool, cool thing, a very simple way to be able to impact the project with a minimal effort. Yeah, probably one </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:56]</span> <strong>Jeff:</strong> of the easiest ways to contribute perhaps, uh, across <span>[00:29:00]</span> all the, the make teams for sure. I&#8217;m sure </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:29:02]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> it is. Yeah,</p>\n\n\n\n<p>that&#8217;s cool. I just, it still blows my mind. What a big thing it is for so little effort. Right. Right. Yeah. So, uh, how many photos did you upload? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:29:20]</span> <strong>Jeff:</strong> Um, I don&#8217;t have the immediate numbers, but I would say that I, so my first interaction with the photo directory was around WordCamp US last year. I published a couple.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, I think I, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:29:36]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> I mean, just in this, uh, this event. Right. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:29:39]</span> <strong>Jeff:</strong> Point being, I think I had done a couple. You know, last fall didn&#8217;t really do any started in January being a bit more active, um, not probably more than like a dozen or two a month, but then I think during the span of the photo event. Uh, probably got, um, you know, I, I was, <span>[00:30:00]</span> you know, the, the cap is five at a time and pretty much as soon as one would get approved or rejected, um, you know, fairly quickly find another one and submit.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So, um, I don&#8217;t know exactly how many I submitted or the total that were accepted, but I, I&#8217;d probably say easily, uh, a dozen or so in that short timeframe. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:30:21]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Um, I am impressed by anybody who got in more than 5 or 10 because the moderation queue was, it was very difficult to maintain. So well done. Um, I had another question.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I&#8217;m trying to remember what it was. How many? Oh, would you do it again? Yeah, definitely. I mean, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:30:48]</span> <strong>Jeff:</strong> I think I. You know, I, I have a friendly, not even a wager, just a friendly competition with, uh, Jonathan DeRozers and, uh, I think Jeff <span>[00:31:00]</span> Galensky, uh, that came out of Twitter of just contributing as a group to the photo directory over the course of this year and just, you know, seeing how much the group of us can, can get published there.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, so I&#8217;ll. You know, continue to try and find ones to to submit. I think if there was another event would happily join in. I think the tagging aspect was a little clunky. So hopefully that can be improved. Um, and given that it was. You know, a community event for me, and it sounds like for others that you talk to it didn&#8217;t feel like there was a lot of a community feel.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So trying to find ways to give it more of that would be, I think, interesting and perhaps, you know, get keep folks more engaged. Um, you know, there was certainly, I think, a kickoff and a conclusion, uh, to the event, um, that was a synchronous call, but, uh, the time didn&#8217;t work for me, it was, I <span>[00:32:00]</span> think, super early on a Friday or Saturday or something, and I think, um,</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:32:02]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> It was Saturday, I remember.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:32:04]</span> <strong>Jeff:</strong> Yeah, I was, yeah, I was five kids, so it was, it was difficult to make that happen. Um, And I think it was, I think it was fun that there was like, uh, awards for, you know, kind of like a, almost like an art show, right? Like best in show sort of thing. And there was monetary, uh, awards, uh, attached to that. Uh, uh, Aaron Jorban, who, you know, I collaborated with, um, as well in, in getting things submitted.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, you know, he was, I think one of the honorable mentions or something, which was kind of cool for him. Um. I think if there were ways to, again, give it more of a community feel would be just a bit more interesting. Um, perhaps, um, like specific, um, side quests or achievements, right? Like a photo, you know, this sort of a photo or, um, you know, this kind of composition.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Right, exactly. Uh, best use of the color red. Who knows, right? Um, <span>[00:33:00]</span> uh, like those are things I think that could be interesting to. You know, give folks an idea of if they&#8217;re, if they&#8217;re going out to actively shoot with a camera or a camera phone to, you know, what to look for versus just like searching your back catalog of things to submit, um, could be fun and could give it a bit more of a community feel.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I mean, the, the site they had up that pulled in, uh, kind of the tagged photos that were accepted was fun to. Browse through and see, but it didn&#8217;t feel like I was really interacting with anybody. Um, and that aspect. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:33:29]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> All right. Um, did this event feel special? Did it feel different from other times you&#8217;ve uploaded photos or were you just given incentive to do it a lot this one week?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:33:43]</span> <strong>Jeff:</strong> Uh, I think it was, it was interesting in that it was, you know, one of these next generation events that I think the community team is trying to, to spur forward. So I think it was fun to participate in that manner. Um, you <span>[00:34:00]</span> know, outside of that, um, you know, I don&#8217;t know that it was dramatically different than the contributions to the photo director I&#8217;ve done in the past, except for the fact that I kind of ratcheted up my attention to, um, keeping that cue of five.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Pictures topped off, right. So I could have things getting into the, the competition as it were. Um, other than, other than that, um, probably not a dramatic difference, uh, for me feeling wise again, because there, there wasn&#8217;t much of like a, a real community aspect of that contribution of, of, of things.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:34:37]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> So basically I&#8217;m hearing that you&#8217;d like just more community involved or something more of a feeling of community during the event.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:34:45]</span> <strong>Jeff:</strong> Yeah, something. I mean, or, or even, uh, you know, WordCamp U. S. last year, there was a physical. Uh, exhibit that had photos, I think from the photo directory printed out, um, and matted and framed in a nice little <span>[00:35:00]</span> photo installed down, uh, in the sponsor area. Um, so </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:35:04]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> They&#8217;re doing that again and WordCamp Asia, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:35:06]</span> <strong>Jeff:</strong> awesome.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So you, I, you know, I could totally see where like, if, you know, this could be done again, perhaps, um, you know, the weeks leading up to a major WordCamp event, uh, and then. You know, maybe sponsored by one of the major sponsors and, um, you know, then the, the best and show the selected ones are actually then printed in, in, uh, shown in, in person at that WordCamp, I think would be really cool.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Um, you know, it gives you, again, it gives you a bit more of a, uh, community feel. Um, but, uh,</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:35:46]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> those are great ideas. Um, tomorrow, my, uh, episode is going to be. About next gen events. Oh, cool. And all the <span>[00:36:00]</span> different ideas people have had for them. There&#8217;s some pretty exciting ones. I&#8217;m, I&#8217;m really looking forward to the future of WordPress events. Yeah. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:36:07]</span> <strong>Jeff:</strong> I mean, I think the. I&#8217;d love to see more of the kids camps.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Um, especially ones that are attached to other events just because, uh, you know, if I&#8217;m already going, it&#8217;s great. It&#8217;d be great to bring my kid along and have them have something that&#8217;s tailored to their interests. Um, and then the, uh, the do actions I&#8217;ve never been able to participate in those. And so I, I, I would love, I would love to have, again, maybe attached to a.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Like a WordCamp, uh, Europe, Asia, U. S., um, you know, the ability to, you know, leverage the skills we have in contributing to the project and, and instead, you know, contribute to, you know, a worthy organization, right? I would love to see that as well. Um, and, and also really curious, what Uh, you know, perhaps all the other next gen ideas are like really excited to see, um, you know, the project branching out just beyond what I still love the camps.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, you know, they&#8217;re, they&#8217;re, <span>[00:37:00]</span> they&#8217;re fantastic. Um, but also really, always really interested and excited to see what else comes up there. So, uh, I&#8217;ll have to stay tuned. You got a, got a good hook for me on that one. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:37:10]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> All right. Well, yep. Check it out tomorrow. All right. That&#8217;s all I have for you today. Thank you for being here.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I appreciate your time. Good to see you Topher. And that concludes our episode for today. I&#8217;m glad you came. Thank you very much. It was really interesting hearing all the different experiences that people had, the variety of experiences. Some took just moments to be involved. Some took hours. And it was exciting to see how a different kind of event can happen.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, which brings me to my next point tomorrow, we&#8217;re going to be talking with Julia Golomb from the community team about next gen events and what they are, what they could be and how you can be involved. So please stop <span>[00:38:00]</span> by.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Wed, 28 Feb 2024 21:16:20 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:14:\"Topher DeRosia\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:38;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:57:\"WPTavern: Automattic Faces Scrutiny Over AI Access Policy\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154448\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:68:\"https://wptavern.com/automattic-faces-scrutiny-over-ai-access-policy\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:6480:\"<p><strong>This article is a joint effort by James Giroux &amp; Jyolsna. </strong></p>\n\n\n\n<p>After <a href=\"https://searchengineland.com/reddit-google-ai-content-licensing-deal-437782\">unconfirmed reports</a> of Google entering into a content licensing agreement with Reddit for training its AI, 404 Media claimed yesterday that <a href=\"https://www.404media.co/tumblr-and-wordpress-to-sell-users-data-to-train-ai-tools/\">Automattic is set to sell Tumblr and WordPress.com users’ content to Midjourney and OpenAI</a>. If true, this could mirror an <a href=\"https://www.theverge.com/2023/7/11/23791528/openai-shutterstock-images-partnership\">extended partnership that Shutterstock entered into with OpenAI</a> last year.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Claims of 404 Media&nbsp;</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>404 Media claims insider information about the deal–backed up with documentation–confirming Automattic is in the advanced stages of negotiation with these AI companies. To validate its claims <a href=\"https://www.404media.co/tumblr-and-wordpress-to-sell-users-data-to-train-ai-tools/\">404 Media quoted Tumblr Product Manager Cyle Gage</a> as he reported on an internal message board, the status of the initial data collection process and how it included content that should not have been collected.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>While 404 Media has provided quotes from an internal source, it has not provided any specific proof such as screenshots of conversations or access to source materials to assist others in validating their claims. 404 Media also refers to user content as “users’ data” which can easily be misconstrued as personally identifiable information (PII) or credit card information. Whereas the content being discussed in the article is content that is already publicly available.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Response From Automattic&nbsp;</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Within a few hours of 404 Media’s article going up, Automattic released a statement describing its position on content distribution and the rights of all users on WordPress.com and Tumblr to opt out of their public content being included in data shared with AI partners.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Automattic makes the argument that AI regulation and legislation do not yet exist and, as such, is taking these steps to proactively provide users with additional methods of controlling how and where their content is made available. They are creating a pathway for AI partners to get streamlined access to the content users are open to sharing while also taking steps to remove access to content that users no longer want to be shared. In other words, the content in question is already available to the AI companies as it’s publicly crawlable and content deals only make it more accessible and manageable.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Automattic published “<a href=\"https://automattic.com/2024/02/27/protecting-user-choice/\">Protecting User Choice</a>” emphasizing the following points:</p>\n\n\n\n<ul>\n<li><em>We currently block, by default, major AI platform crawlers—including ones from the biggest tech companies—and update our lists as new ones launch.</em></li>\n\n\n\n<li><em>We have a setting to discourage search engines from indexing a site on WordPress.com and Tumblr. This signals to search engines not to crawl that content or include it in search results.</em></li>\n\n\n\n<li><em>We have added similar settings to WordPress.com and Tumblr to discourage crawling by AI companies. If you already discourage search engine indexing, this is automatically enabled.</em></li>\n\n\n\n<li><em>We will share only public content that’s hosted on WordPress.com and Tumblr from sites that haven’t opted out.</em></li>\n</ul>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p><strong>We will share only public content that’s hosted on WordPress.com and Tumblr from sites that haven’t opted out.</strong></p>\n</blockquote>\n\n\n\n<p>The <a href=\"https://automattic.com/2024/02/27/protecting-user-choice/\">article</a> continues hinting at a deal in the future: “We are also working directly with select AI companies as long as their plans align with what our community cares about: attribution, opt-outs, and control. Our partnerships will respect all opt-out settings. We also plan to take that a step further and regularly update any partners about people who newly opt out and ask that their content be removed from past sources and future training.”&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Automattic also released a <a href=\"https://wordpress.com/blog/2024/02/27/more-control-over-the-content-you-share/\">new tool</a> that “lets you opt out of sharing content from your public blogs with third parties, including AI platforms that use such content for training models. We will engage with AI companies that we can have productive relationships with, and are working to give you an easy way to control access to your content…We already discourage AI crawlers from gathering content from WordPress.com and will continue to do so, save for those with which we partner… We are committed to making sure our partners respect those decisions.”</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">WordPress.org Users Aren’t Affected</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Josepha Haden Chomphosy, Executive Director of WordPress shared this with the community in the Slack channel: “I can confirm that the WordPress project is not involved in selling user data or content for AI training purposes. This has been our consistent stance across the long history of WordPress, even as recently as when I was sharing<a href=\"https://wordpress.org/news/2023/01/letter-from-wordpress-executive-director-2022/\"> thoughts for the future of our project heading into 2023</a>.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Later, Jetpack <a href=\"https://twitter.com/jetpack/status/1762620580589920361\">tweeted</a> that “data from Jetpack connected sites is not included. This only applies to WordPress.com hosted sites.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Interestingly, Automattic has been struggling to make Tumblr profitable after acquiring it in 2019. Last year Matt revealed that <a href=\"https://techcrunch.com/2023/07/12/tumblr-is-losing-30m-each-year-ceo-says/\">Tumblr is losing $30M</a> each year.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We have reached out to Chenda Ngak (Head of Communications at Automattic) and will update this article once we get her quote. </p>\n\n\n\n<p>(WordPress (or WordPress.org) is an open-source CMS while WordPress.com is a hosted platform owned by Automattic, a company founded by Matt Mullenweg. Both are not the same.)</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Wed, 28 Feb 2024 19:11:40 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:7:\"Jyolsna\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:39;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:98:\"WPTavern: #110 – Thomas J. Raef on the Shift in How Hackers Attack, and How to Protect Your Site\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:48:\"https://wptavern.com/?post_type=podcast&p=154445\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:110:\"https://wptavern.com/podcast/110-thomas-j-raef-on-the-shift-in-how-hackers-attack-and-how-to-protect-your-site\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:49263:\"Transcript<div>\n<p>[00:00:00] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> Welcome to the jukebox podcast from WP Tavern. My name is Nathan Wrigley.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Jukebox is a podcast which is dedicated to all things WordPress. The people, the events, the plugins, the blocks, the themes, and in this case how your session cookies are being used to attack WordPress websites.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>If you&#8217;d like to subscribe to the podcast, you can do that by searching for WP Tavern in your podcast player of choice. Or by going to WPTavern.com forward slash feed forward slash podcast. And you can copy that URL into most podcast players.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>If you have a topic that you&#8217;d like us to feature on the podcast, I&#8217;m keen to hear from you and hopefully get you, or your idea, featured on the show. Head to WPTavern.com forward slash contact forward slash jukebox, and use the form there.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So on the podcast today, we have Thomas J Raef.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Thomas is the founder of We Watch Your Website, a company that has been removing malware from websites since 2007. During that time, he&#8217;s seen many changes in the methods hackers use to take over our website, and that&#8217;s the focus of the podcast today.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>With hackers becoming increasingly agile in their tactics, targeting everything from plugins to session cookies, Thomas brings to the table data he&#8217;s gathered from 2023, that puts the spotlight on the evolving digital threat landscape.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>He explains how the system that he runs is able to gather a very large data set about WordPress websites in real time. Recording data directly from the server, he&#8217;s devised systems, which makes sense of this data. He&#8217;s able to turn back the clock and trace the stack of circumstances which led to a website being compromised.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We&#8217;re all used to hearing that plugins themes, and sometimes the WordPress core, are the most likely culprits when something goes wrong. The story goes that out of date code, or a zero day is discovered and leveraged. Whilst Thomas does not doubt that this is true, he&#8217;s here to paint a somewhat different picture. A picture which puts the focus upon stolen session cookies as the most important factor in website attacks last year.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Thomas explains what session cookies are, and why they unlock so much potential for a hacker. He tells us about the ways that session cookies are harvested, and the ways that you can mitigate the problem.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>If you&#8217;ve ever been concerned about the security of your WordPress site, or intrigued by the intricacies of cyber security, this episode is for you.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>If you&#8217;re interested in finding out more, you can find all of the links in the show notes by heading to WPTavern.com forward slash podcast, where you&#8217;ll find all the other episodes as well.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And so without further delay, I bring you Thomas J. Rafe.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I am joined on the podcast today by Thomas Raef. Hello, Thomas.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:03:29] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> Hello, Nathan. How are you?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:03:30] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> Yeah. Good thank you. Firstly, dear listener, I have to extend my sincerest thanks to Thomas. For reasons that I won&#8217;t go into, Thomas and I have had to cancel a podcast appointment on multiple occasions, and by multiple, I really truly do mean multiple.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So I just want to extend my thanks to Thomas for sticking with me. Coming back on many occasions only to find that a, I wasn&#8217;t there, or b, I wasn&#8217;t able to do the interview. So apologies for all that, Thomas, and thank you for staying the course. Really appreciate it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:04:00] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> Not a problem at all.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:04:01] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> So Thomas is joining us today and we&#8217;re going to have a fairly in-depth conversation about security.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I know this is a topic that you&#8217;ve probably heard little bits and pieces about before, I think unless you&#8217;ve read the article that we&#8217;re going to delve into, I think it&#8217;s quite likely that you won&#8217;t have heard what Thomas has got to say. Now because we&#8217;re delving into security and security is a very technical thing and getting the right intuitions about security requires knowledge.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I think Thomas, it would be great if you could just paint a little bit of a picture. Give us your potted bio if you like, about who you are, what the company is that you founded and so on. Just so that we have some inclination that you know what it is that you are talking about.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:04:44] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> Okay, sure. Yeah. I started, I&#8217;ve been in the IT industry since, as I tell people, IBM has one month more experience in the PC market than I do.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>They started, originally released the IBM PC in September of 81. And, I started working with PCs in October of 81. So in 2007, 2006, I&#8217;m sorry, I was working more toward security. More and more people were getting hacked. This was well after the I Love You virus and all the, popular ones. And I was just really inquisitive.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So got started in 2007 with the company that I founded, We Watch Your Website. Nobody ever asked me what does your company do? But, I started that company, it was to address the need for malware remediation on websites. That&#8217;s it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>People ask about, oh, my computer&#8217;s infected. Can you help me? I can, but it&#8217;s not, that&#8217;s not what we do. So at any rate, we started that. I started We Watch Your Website. Belonged to a website called Badware Busters, which was started by Max Weinstein, who I believe now is with Sophos.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>He&#8217;s a Harvard grad. Google would send people to badwarebusters.org with their infected websites, get help for free. Daniel Sid, who founded Sucuri. And so I learned a lot, and started applying that to helping people with infected websites.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Got a call from Bluehost one day, helped out, Matt Heaton, the founder with his personal website, and they&#8217;re like, hey, how would you like if we sent you some business? And I was like, oh, okay. And for the longest time I was their default to go to for infected websites, so that I learned a lot.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Had to automate a lot because they were sending me so many sites, so much business. So I had to automate our procedures a lot, but people also wanted to know how their sites were infected. So it got me down the avenue of reading, log files, and how could I record things and, infections in the database and so on, so forth.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So we&#8217;ve been doing this now since 2007. As of now, the day of this recording, we are now watching over 12 and a half million websites. Gives us a lot of data.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:07:06] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> Yeah, a very large amount of data. We&#8217;ll get into that. So first of all, dear listener, I think it&#8217;s probably a good idea if you are listening to this, to perhaps pause the recording and go and read an article, which is on the We Watch Your Website blog.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Now, had we been able to record this podcast episode at the first opportunity. We probably wouldn&#8217;t have been so far away in time because this article was written on the 3rd of January, 2024. So it&#8217;s not the newest one, but the information, I presume is still up to date and you are sticking by the conclusions that you made there.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And the article is called The Real Attack Vector Responsible for 60% of Hacked WordPress Sites. And we&#8217;ll get into what that 60% is, and potentially how it differs from what most people, I would imagine think is the cause of problems on WordPress websites throughout the world. But first of all, wanted to dive into the sort of technical details of how it is that your system works.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So you mentioned that you&#8217;ve automated a lot of things. You mentioned that there are gigantic amounts of log files being created all the time. But I wonder if you would tell us how your system differs from what typically most WordPress users will do, which is install some plugin. Your service is not that. So tell us what it is that you do, and how it differs from what a plugin can do.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:08:34] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> Yeah. One of the problems with the security plugins, not all, is that it only operates at the application layer. So it can only see things, its way. On a VPS or a dedicated server or a cloud server like Digital Ocean, Vultr, et cetera.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We can actually install some agents on there that give us information at the network layer. Like for instance, one of the problems with a lot of security plugins that we&#8217;ve seen is they&#8217;ll see an attack from an IP address, but that IP address has been spoofed by the hackers because of the way the security plugin was written.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So our information is the raw IP address, like we&#8217;re seeing it at the network level of the server. Doesn&#8217;t matter if it&#8217;s WordPress or anything else, we&#8217;re seeing the raw IP address. So that gives us an advantage there. So, the information that we collect, on a live basis on a server based account is we grab the access logs live.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We&#8217;re also monitoring the database for changes live. We&#8217;re monitoring the files, they call it the file integrity monitoring is the term that they, they like to use. So we&#8217;re watching for any file changes on your website. And then we&#8217;re also watching the processes.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The processes run in memory on your server. There&#8217;s certain elements in the processes that can tip us off to an infection, or an attack. And for all these logs, like I said we&#8217;re, right now we&#8217;re monitoring 12 and a half million websites.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We have seven clusters that collect this data, and each of these clusters can collect 20 million log entries per second. And then it correlates all this information. So you log into a WordPress site, there&#8217;s an entry in the database, it only stays in there until you log out. Now if you don&#8217;t log out the information stays in there, but we want to capture it as it happens. So that&#8217;s why we&#8217;re monitoring the database live.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So yeah, you log into a WordPress site, there&#8217;s activity in the access log, where you came from, your user agent, things like that. You know what point you went to. Changes in the database. So we capture that as well. And our system has been designed to be smart enough so it knows a failed attempt versus, a session cookie. If you just close your browser and then you open it back up again and you&#8217;re still logged in, that&#8217;s because your session cookie is still active.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So we can tell that type of login versus you&#8217;re logging in with a username and password. We can see attacks, sometimes we see attacks before they&#8217;ve been announced. Other times, we&#8217;re just seeing them like everybody else is. So that&#8217;s the information that we&#8217;re gathering, and how we&#8217;re gathering it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:11:39] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> I&#8217;m imagining a WordPress website. This may be a terrible analogy, but I&#8217;m imagining a WordPress website, a bit like a layered cake. And the front end of the website, I&#8217;m imagining is the icing on the top. So that&#8217;s the very top, and you can go down, and you get into the plugin space and you get into the admin space, and eventually you get into the sort of base layers of the cake. And at this point we&#8217;re onto the hardware and the software that the WordPress site is running on. So we&#8217;re thinking about the operating system that your host is using.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And from what you&#8217;ve said, and forgive me if I get this technically wrong, but it sounds like your system is able to access the lower down levels of that cake, the base layer if you like. Things approaching root access to the OS, things like that. So from that, it sounds like you can gather a different set of data than a plugin may be able to, and I guess your contention would be that because you are able to gather that different set of data, and it probably doesn&#8217;t have the capacity to be modified.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Once you&#8217;ve gathered that data in real time, you can then spend time looking back at that data in the days, weeks, months after. Patterns may have been discovered. You discover patterns and you can figure out what&#8217;s happened. So does that layer description work fairly well, with WordPress at the top, and the OS, the computer that it&#8217;s running on at the bottom, and you are injecting yourself as close to the bottom as you can?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:13:07] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> Yes. Perfect analogy. You summed it up nicely. Yeah, we&#8217;re working at the, at a range, and typically at a root level, where the username that&#8217;s running the WordPress site doesn&#8217;t have access to the stuff, as you described, at the lower layers that can&#8217;t get, that user doesn&#8217;t have access, doesn&#8217;t have permissions, authentication, to access the stuff at the lower levels of the cake. And that&#8217;s where we operate. We can&#8217;t be tampered with unless you have root access, and hacker has root access that&#8217;s game over.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:13:42] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> Okay. So that&#8217;s the first thing to notice. You are able to gather a different type of data than a plugin would do, simply because the plugin cannot typically, there may be scenarios where it can, I don&#8217;t know, but typically it can&#8217;t get outside of WordPress, so it can&#8217;t necessarily get to the operating system which is running WordPress. That might be Linux or whatever it is, but your system can.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>If that&#8217;s the case, I&#8217;m presuming that if you want to use your service. It&#8217;s not a WordPress plugin. You are in some way getting access to the server. If I was to sign up as a client of yours, what would that process look like? Do you ask for SSH details from me and things like that?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:14:28] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> Yeah, basically. We typically provide our public key for SSH and you can install it, we can install it. And then that gives us the access, the accessibility that we need to implement our system onto your server. We watch all the sites on that server. It is just something with me from years and years ago, I couldn&#8217;t see why if I have access to all of your sites, why I should charge you per site. It never made sense, and that&#8217;s just me. I&#8217;m not saying my way is right. That&#8217;s just me. Yeah, we cover every site on that server and it&#8217;s just easier that way.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:15:03] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> So you are collecting data at this root level, in many cases I would imagine, in real time. And you said that could run on seven clusters of servers that you yourself have got. So it&#8217;s everything that&#8217;s happening on the server is reporting things in real time to you. And I think you mentioned the slightly jaw dropping number of 20 million. Log files could be written per second.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>That sounds to me like a fairly unmanageable amount of data to look at. I&#8217;m imagining a spreadsheet with an additional 20 million rows added per second. And, I&#8217;m quickly realizing that no human can actually take any meaningful glance at that and get any data out.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So you talked about automation. Do you just want to get into that a little bit? What are you doing there? Because my immediate intuition here is that you are looking backwards in time to find problems that have occurred. So maybe somebody&#8217;s come to you and, something quirky is going on with my website.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Please, can you look back and see if there&#8217;s something that has happened? So is that what you are doing? Are you looking back in time to spot patterns? Or are you also looking for things happening in real time to prevent known let&#8217;s call it attacks for now?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:16:19] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> Both. For the report that we&#8217;re talking about today, obviously we went back in time. So we have a huge ScyllaDB database, that&#8217;s pretty much spread around the world. And so all this information is gathered and put into that database.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And then from there we can run our queries for these reports. Yeah, we can look back in time. But also, in real time, our system is watching for these patterns. Yes, in creating this report we did spot a number of new patterns along the way.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>You dig in further there into your data, because you have all the data, and you can see that these patterns had started a year ago or so. And were repeating with different sites around the world. So, to answer your question, yeah, we do analyze things in real time, so we can see when a hacker or someone from a Digital Ocean server, let&#8217;s say. I don&#8217;t want to pick on Digital Ocean, but let&#8217;s say one of their servers was logging into your WordPress site. Now there&#8217;s a obviously a couple things that could be happening there.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Somebody could be using like a management console, like a MainWP, ManageWP, some of those, WP Umbrella. Some of those types of management systems. And that&#8217;s something you install on your own server and then it connects to your website. But, we know about those. Typically a server, or let&#8217;s say a GoDaddy server. Why would a GoDaddy server want to be logging into your WordPress site over and over again? And it has an outdated user agent. There&#8217;s a couple of red flags there. Those types of things we block, we filter in real time and block.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:18:05] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> Okay, so you&#8217;re spotting patterns for things that have happened and you are doing that after the fact. But you&#8217;re also gaining, I guess useful information from those patterns to create rules which can prevent things from happening. Because you can see this pattern is recurring. Okay, it&#8217;s now cropping up over here. Let&#8217;s block that traffic, because we know that is very likely to be malicious. The user agent is five years out of date, and it&#8217;s coming from a server that has no business logging in at all. It&#8217;s not an end user. There&#8217;s something quite strange here. And so in that way, you are preventing things.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Okay. I think we&#8217;ve got a vague handle on what it is that you gather, and why you gather it, and how you gather it. Obviously, if you want to reach out to Tom and talk about this, you can do, I&#8217;m sure by the end of the podcast we&#8217;ll have dropped an email or a contact form or something like that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>But I&#8217;m going to link back now to the article. Once again, it&#8217;ll be linked in the show notes, and I&#8217;ll give you the title again. The Real Attack Vector Responsible for 60% of Hacked WordPress Sites in the Year 2023. So we&#8217;re looking back at the previous year.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Now, I think that if I was to ask more or less, let&#8217;s say I had a thousand WordPress users in a room, and I was to ask them, what is responsible for the majority of problems with WordPress websites in terms of let&#8217;s say being hacked. I know that you didn&#8217;t want to use that word, but let&#8217;s just use it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I think the intuition would be, it&#8217;ll be problems with themes, plugins and possibly, but not very often, Core. But plugins and themes. I think most people&#8217;s intuitions will be out of date or vulnerable, zero day problems with plugins from and themes. And you are saying no to that. You&#8217;re not saying that doesn&#8217;t exist, but what you are saying is that there is a much bigger attack surface, which I genuinely didn&#8217;t even know about until I read this article.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>But you&#8217;ve got three types of attacks. Let&#8217;s just list those out quickly. We&#8217;ve got the first one is compromise username and password credentials. I don&#8217;t think we need to go into that too much. Obviously if you&#8217;re distributing your username and password everywhere, or it&#8217;s been part of the LastPass breach, we know that anybody can log in as you right.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Plugins and themes. We&#8217;ve just touched on that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>But you are saying that there&#8217;s this other thing, stolen session cookies, and your contention is that the majority, not just a small slice of the cake, the majority of problems, compromise problems with WordPress websites is to do with this.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So firstly, can we lay out the groundwork? What is a session cookie and how can it be stolen, and how impactful can the stealing of a session cookie be?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:21:01] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> A session cookie is required with http, https. It maintains your session basically, so that, if you&#8217;re on, let&#8217;s say you&#8217;re on an e-comm website, and you add some stuff to your shopping cart, and then you browse around the site, and then you come back to your shopping cart. And you say, oh, okay, yeah, I&#8217;m going to, order this stuff.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The session cookie is required so that it knows you from somebody else visiting the site at the exact same time, putting stuff in their cart. It keeps your session separate.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>In the case of WordPress and our research in particular, a session cookie keeps you logged in, or shows WordPress that you are logged in with valid credentials.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So you go to your WordPress website, log into WP admin, enter your username and password. Hopefully it&#8217;s using some form of 2FA or MFA, to help you be more secure. But now you&#8217;re in, and as you&#8217;re bouncing around different pages, WordPress needs to know that, okay, yes, you are authenticated to go to this page and to do this activity.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And that&#8217;s all, that&#8217;s what the session cookie does. It&#8217;s a little piece of code on your local computer, on your local device, that your browser saves that tells the website that yes, you are authenticated to do these activities as an administrator on that WordPress site.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:22:33] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> Can I just pause you there and can we just delve into that a little bit more deeply? Because I, I know that there&#8217;s going to be a bunch of people listening to this who are very technically proficient and they&#8217;ll probably be thinking, Nathan, this is all very straightforward. But equally, I think there&#8217;ll be a bunch of people who, what you just described is not entirely obvious. So let&#8217;s just drill down on that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So if I go to wptavern.com and I go to the login page and I enter my username and password and 2FA or what have you, and I&#8217;m now logged in. The WordPress website has then provided something to my browser. It is unique for that session.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So if I then go to another page or leave the browser window open and come back, let&#8217;s say in 24 hours, when I am browsing around, every time I try to do something new, go to a new page, add a new post, or what have you, that cookie is being requested and there&#8217;s a check going on to say, is this person allowed?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Do we have authentication to say that this person in the recent past logged in and we know them. And that&#8217;s happening all the time, right? Until we log out. And if we log out, that cookie is expunged, it&#8217;s deleted. And that&#8217;s the reason that if we go to, let&#8217;s say I&#8217;m in Chrome and I&#8217;m logged in successfully to WordPress, and then I open up Firefox and try to use my WordPress website, it won&#8217;t allow it. Because that cookie has not been lodged in the browser.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And if I was to open up a private or incognito window, the same thing. It&#8217;s a different silo. I can&#8217;t interact until I&#8217;ve logged in again. So this cookie, if you like, is the gatekeeper for my access until I log out. So the possession of that exact cookie proves who I am, and it&#8217;s the only thing, it&#8217;s the only thing which entitles me to use the website. So if I can somehow get hold of that cookie, and it&#8217;s not my cookie, let&#8217;s say I&#8217;m logged into your website. If I can get hold of Thomas&#8217;s cookie for his WordPress website, I can impersonate you a hundred percent you. No caveats, no ifs, no buts. I am you. Have I got that right?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:24:43] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> Yep, exactly. It is the key to the kingdom.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:24:46] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> So if that could be taken from me, all bets are off. As far as any machine in the world is concerned, any computer that I&#8217;m using at that moment, if I can get that cookie, I can be you. In the case of a WordPress website, I can then delete every piece of content that has ever been written on that website. I can deface the website in any way I see fit. If I happen to steal the session cookie for your Amazon website, obviously I have the credentials to go and use your credit cards and buy and, whatever it is that I wish. So this cookie really is, it is the gatekeeper for everything, and you are saying it&#8217;s being stolen.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:25:27] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> Yes, big time.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:25:28] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> It&#8217;s not trivial. It sounds like, stolen session cookie, it&#8217;s a, it&#8217;s a stolen session cookie. It sounds benign, but it really is unlocking complete access to whatever it is that user in WordPress is entitled to do. And obviously if it&#8217;s an administrator role, that&#8217;s a problem.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Okay, so the next thing I have to ask is, how on earth do I get your cookie? How is it possible that cookies can escape the confines of my browser? How can that be achieved?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:25:56] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> There&#8217;s a number of ways, and big thing if you really want to go down the rabbit hole, as Oliver from Patchstack likes to call things, you can Google the term info stealer, and you can see how big a market that is in the underground. Info stealers bypass antivirus programs, they bypass almost everything and they have access to your computer.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Let&#8217;s say, in our scenario here, you log into a WordPress site, you don&#8217;t log out, you just close the browser window, or you leave it open, whatever. You go to another website, your computer gets infected with an info stealer, first thing it, it does is grab all the information at can.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So it&#8217;s grabbing your bank information. Information about your computer, your browser, all sorts of information. But it&#8217;s also grabbing session cookies because those are, they&#8217;re easy to use. And, as you said the gatekeeper to so many things.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So it records all that information, and the info stealers start to use it in whatever way they can. And I was just reading a report yesterday where they said that within 10 seconds after an info stealer has infected somebody&#8217;s computer, it steals all the information that it needs, then it&#8217;s gone.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So it could delete itself so there&#8217;s no trace. So you, don&#8217;t think, oh geez, my antivirus just found this info stealer on my computer after I ran a full system scan. I should contact my bank. No, they don&#8217;t want you to think about all that. They want to be able to sell your information or use it themselves. So, 10 seconds, bam, they&#8217;re gone. They&#8217;ve taken everything they need.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:27:38] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> This then is an attack which is perpetrated typically onto the computer that you are using. So I&#8217;m sitting in front of my Mac, could be Windows, could be Linux. So it&#8217;s a vulnerability that somebody has discovered in the OS that I&#8217;m using. So Mac, Linux, Windows, what have you. We know how this works. There&#8217;s so many routes into this, but one might be that you accidentally click on a malicious link in an email and it takes you somewhere and you may be on a website, which looks like a legitimate website, but is actually downloading a payload and opening it up.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We don&#8217;t need to get into that, but have I got that right? This is something which is installed on your local computer. One of its primary things will be to consume bank details and all that, but also to just what browsers are there. Can we please have all the session cookies? We extract those, remove the offending software, and it&#8217;s like nothing ever happened. Again, have I parsed that about right now?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:28:33] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> Yep, perfectly.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:28:34] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> Okay. So I guess all the caveats around not clicking links in emails and keeping your operating system up to date, and the general hygiene of being a custodian of a computer. But you are saying though, that it will go into the browser, suck out all of the cookies, and from that moment on, if I, and we&#8217;ll just stick to WordPress from now on, if I haven&#8217;t logged out of my WordPress website.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And obviously if I&#8217;m a manager of a hundred WordPress websites, oh boy, then you could have a hundred WordPress website cookies in there. How long do I have for the attacker to go and do their dastardly work? I know that if I leave my WordPress website and I don&#8217;t click logout, at some point it logs me out. But I don&#8217;t entirely know what that length of time is. I have this intuition. It&#8217;s two days or 14 days or something. like that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:29:29] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> You&#8217;re right on,both accounts. It typically, it&#8217;s 48 hours, from the time you logged in. But, if you click on the remember me, on your login page for a WordPress, the session cookie stays live for up to two weeks. Now, that&#8217;s only if you do not log out. If you log out, it instantly expires the session cookie. So it won&#8217;t matter if your session cookie&#8217;s stolen or not. It&#8217;s expired, so it can&#8217;t be reused, but so it&#8217;s 48 hours or two weeks.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:30:03] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> So that&#8217;s interesting. The one utterly mitigating factor here is that if you simply log out of any of these services, the WordPress website we&#8217;ll use again as the example. If I was to simply log out each time that I&#8217;d finished working, that cookie, even if it was stolen, it&#8217;s of no use.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>They would be asked to log in again. So, okay, but, if I&#8217;ve clicked remember me, the attackers who stole the, let&#8217;s say I&#8217;m on the, website today. I log in today, I click remember me, and moments after I do that, by coincidence my computer is, all of that data is exfiltrated away from it. They&#8217;ve got 14 days to impersonate me, and presumably there&#8217;s the capacity for them to continue to pretend to be me beyond 14 days. Do they have the capacity to extend that 14 day window by, oh, I don&#8217;t know, going to a particular page which authenticates me again or something?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:31:01] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> No, originally that was my impression was that they could extend that time period. My friend Calvin quickly corrected me on that, on that little bit. So no, you can by going into the database. Once you have admin rights, you could go into the database and change things in the, in the database table, the user meta, and extend the life of the cookie. But, no. There isn&#8217;t any way that you can extend that. I recently, I corrected that in the article. You have up to two weeks.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:31:30] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> So how do you spot that this is happening?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:31:33] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> Obviously if you&#8217;re, If you&#8217;re logging in with username and password, you have to go to WP admin or WP login, and log in. With a stolen session cookie you don&#8217;t need to do that. The session cookie is active, non expired, however you want to call it. I could just go and access a URL of plugin install dot PHP, and give it the parameters that follow that, and it&#8217;ll install that plugin. I don&#8217;t have to authenticate.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And the thing about session cookies that I also want to mention right now is, session cookies are valuable because they bypass 2FA, because you&#8217;re already authenticated. It bypasses 2FA, MFA, everything. You&#8217;re in. So yeah, I could install a bogus plugin. I can install a bogus theme. Anything you can do in a query string, basically as an admin, you can do with a stolen session cookie.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:32:35] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> So in the logs that you are seeing then, is the way to see this that suddenly some entity on the internet just crops up and successfully requests a page that they shouldn&#8217;t have been able to access. So in this case, you were talking about installing a plugin.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The typical route to that would be to log in, but you don&#8217;t see any activity from that IP address, and what have you, going through the login process, and because that&#8217;s missing, you are then inferring from that, hang on. How can they have missed the login step? They must have used a stolen cookie in order to achieve this. Is that about right?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:33:18] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> Yeah. And being able to go back in time, as we mentioned before, gives us a lot of power because we can see, was there a login from this IP address? Now some people will say, IP addresses can change in the middle of a session, blah, blah, blah.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yeah, but the way our system works is you&#8217;re not going to see a login, from Canada and then four hours, 4, 5, 6 hours late, whatever, have a login from Hong Kong. It&#8217;s virtually impossible. So what our system does is, it goes back and says, okay, when was the last valid login?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>People say, you can&#8217;t tell that from a, from an access log. Again, access logs are not the only thing that we monitor. We also monitor the database so we can see who logged in, from where, with what user agent, so on, so forth. All that is recorded and kept.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So we can say, okay, John logged in from Canada on Monday, and we see that he used the username and login, and bam. So he logged in and now, a day later, somebody from wherever, Hong Kong, or from a server suddenly just went right to the WP admin slash plugin dash install dot PHP, with a long query string, telling it what plugin to install.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Plus you see in the database another access happening. So there&#8217;s a combination of things going on that when all correlated, paints a perfect picture of. Okay, this person, the person from Hong Kong, accessed with the session cookie, probably taken from John in Canada when he logged in the other day because it&#8217;s the same username, but now he&#8217;s in Hong Kong and they just installed a bogus plugin. So, it doesn&#8217;t take a rocket scientist to put all this together and say, yeah, okay, unequivocally, that was a stolen session cookie.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:35:21] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> So if you go to the article, again, it&#8217;ll be linked in the show notes. You can see there are some log entries written out, or there&#8217;s a screenshot taken of this exact process. So you can see what&#8217;s going on, and what I&#8217;m inferring from this is if you were to just look at a handful of logs, just two or three log entries, pretty much everything would look benign.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Any single log entry is going to appear broadly legitimate. Obviously if you&#8217;ve got a Chrome user agent dating back to, 2006, there&#8217;s probably something weird going on there. But broadly speaking, any one of those logs in isolation could be legitimate. It&#8217;s the picture that you are building up over time. You know the we had somebody in Canada. Now we have somebody in Hong Kong. They&#8217;re coming, they&#8217;re doing things, which it looks like they ought to have had to log in order to do. And you&#8217;re just building up this tapestry, this mosaic of different things and inferring, different things from that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Okay, so I think we&#8217;ve got a handle with that. Now we&#8217;re going to go towards the sort of middle of the article, and this is probably where we&#8217;ll round off this conversation because, you&#8217;ve summarized the findings from 2023 and you&#8217;ve got a couple of charts. One is a pie chart, which spells things out really easily. And this pie chart is called yearly distribution of hack root causes in 2023.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And again, my intuition would&#8217;ve been plugins, themes, core, would&#8217;ve been the big slice of that pie. And your data is telling you that makes almost 33%. So it&#8217;s almost exactly a third, and I would&#8217;ve expected that to be significantly bigger.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Compromised logins, so stolen through stealing the computer or just getting into a LastPass vault, or just asking somebody what their user name and password was, 7.2%.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Now that leaves us with a remaining almost exactly 60%, almost two thirds is this stolen session cookie. So the takeaway that you&#8217;ve got is the vast majority of infections, hacks, whatever we want to call it, is coming via this mechanism. That&#8217;s fairly surprising. Was that something you expected to see?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:37:39] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> Not at all. I fully expected to see more of the core, plugin, theme vulnerabilities. This was originally intended to, a, to see exactly where the numbers fall. But also I wanted to, with no request, but I wanted to share this information with Oliver from Patchstack.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>He&#8217;s got some valid data, a large amount of data, to show that this is how hackers are hacking is through vulnerable plugins and themes. But, yeah, it didn&#8217;t turn out that way at all. I was shocked, and I ran through the numbers so many times. I had to delay this report so many times because I was just like, no, this can&#8217;t be</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:38:20] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> Yeah, because it&#8217;s not the intuition that we have, it&#8217;s not the received wisdom. It&#8217;s not what we see being talked about online in blog posts and what have you.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Interesting addendum to that pie chart though, is another chart which sits beneath it, and it&#8217;s more akin to a bar chart. But what it shows is that, if you were to take this month by month. So it takes that entire year and it divides it up into month by month, and you can see the data. And it does show that in certain periods of the year 2023, that intuition of it&#8217;s going to be plugins, themes, and core. That was in fact the case.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>For certain periods of time, plugins, themes, core was the dominant problem. And for example, your data is pointing that in April, 2023, plugins, themes, core was the major problem. And can you correlate that to some sort of zero day, or some widely used plugin, or some core update. Are you able to match that against a widely known problem with an external third party piece of software like a plugin?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:39:26] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> plugin? Yes, right around that time is when the essential add-ons for Elementor was hit. That was huge. That particular point in time was right when essential add-ons for Elementor had a zero day, and hackers went crazy.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:39:41] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> Okay, so what we&#8217;re learning from that is, or maybe I&#8217;ve got my intuitions wrong, but also I should say that the same sort of thing seems to have happened in July, and we could get into what was the problem there. But it seems that from your data, the hackers are agile in their approach to this.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So in other words, if their primary vector during the year 2023 was stealing session cookies and there&#8217;s no major problems, no zero day exploits amongst WordPress plugins and themes. They&#8217;ll concentrate on the session cookie, because if there&#8217;s no big problems with plugins and themes, this is going to be our best vector of attack.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Then they&#8217;ll drop that, and go to the plugin, theme attack at the moment where that looks like it&#8217;s going to offer the best, I really don&#8217;t mean to say the word best, but for them at least, it&#8217;s going to be more useful for them to flip over to attacking that particular zero day in a plugin or a theme or whatever it may be. And so they switch. So they&#8217;re not stupid.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:40:42] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> They&#8217;re not. I tell people this all the time. I hate to give hackers credit, but they&#8217;re some of the smartest people in the world. I&#8217;ve said for years that if hackers ever focused on a cure for cancer, there&#8217;d be no cancer. These people are smart.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The people who write the code, there&#8217;s various levels of hackers and, they&#8217;re not all super smart, but the ones who write the code, they&#8217;re extremely smart and yeah, and agile. As you can see. Like I said, I&#8217;ve had other people ask me why do you think that they shifted so much to stolen session cookies? Because just Google info stealers, and you&#8217;ll see just a plethora of information. Entire company&#8217;s dedicated to tracking info stealers.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>There&#8217;s a company in Israel that buys old computers from people, and they dissect these computers and find out that, how many info stealers are on these computers.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>It&#8217;s a huge market. Some people say, oh no, it&#8217;s, that rarely happens. No, it happens a lot. And it&#8217;s not just my information, it&#8217;s information from many other security companies on how prevalent this is.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>To me it lends credence to how effective something like a Patchstack is at preventing Infections through plugins and themes and core because, that&#8217;s what they do. That&#8217;s what they focus on. So to me hackers saw the writing on the wall. Okay more and more people are implementing processes and procedures to prevent us from hacking their core themes and, plugins.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So we have to shift our focus here, and okay, we got all these info stealers that are running rampant. We&#8217;ll just have them steal session cookies too. Because, when you think about the whole spectrum of computer security. How are most attacks carried out? Oh, through an infected website. Well, how do you get those? Oh, let&#8217;s steal session cookies. One just feeds on the other. So it&#8217;s a logical progression for hackers, and they need them for phishing, infected websites for majority of their attacks.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Steal session cookies. We don&#8217;t have to worry about 2FA. Seems like the whole world is starting to shift towards 2FA. Stolen session cookies bypasses 2FA. We get access to website. It&#8217;s like a perfect scenario for them.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:42:59] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> So we&#8217;re used to the mantra of update plugins, update themes, keep WordPress core up to date. And nowadays inside a reasonably up-to-date WordPress website, there&#8217;s the option to automate all of that. And there are, you mentioned things like MainWP and ManageWP and what have you.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>There are these services which will assist you in that. But now we have this new problem of session cookies. Are there any bits of advice that you could give for remediating this problem? We touched on logging out as a really credible way of doing it, but is there anything else that you would advise a typical user of WordPress that they can do to, mitigate this? Because it does sound as if, if your session cookie is stolen, you really are putting your feet to the fire a little bit. So what can we do?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:43:47] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> Other than logging out, you have two good options. The first one is Fortress by Calvin. He controls, the whole Fortress, is a, like a login system, if you will. That&#8217;s putting it lightly.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>But, it controls session cookies in a way that keeps them very short term, and forces auto log out and so forth.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The other option is SolidWP. Nice thing about SolidWP is they tie the IP address into the session cookie. So guess what? Somebody steals your session cookie, they&#8217;re going to go use it from Hong Kong, they can&#8217;t. It&#8217;s a separate, it&#8217;s a different IP address. Case closed.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:44:32] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> So there go. Three bits of advice. You&#8217;ve got a couple of services that you can use there, but also just log out. It&#8217;s a fairly surprising set of results that you came up with in 2023, and I guess on some level it is also, it&#8217;s kind of misery making in a way, isn&#8217;t it? Because it just demonstrates that the hackers are serious about this and they&#8217;re credible at what they do. And I guess it&#8217;s a process of just listening to advice from people like you and trying to stay one step ahead.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I guess you&#8217;ll be doing this again in 2024, and we&#8217;ll see if the, ground has moved. Let&#8217;s hope it has, and that slice of the pie that 66% has in some way gone down.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Thomas, if somebody wants to reach out to you and have a chat about this, talk about what it is that you do and what have you, where are the best places that they can find you?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:45:22] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> They can email me. It&#8217;s traef, traef@wewatchyourwebsite.com. They can find me on Skype, We Watch Your Website.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I&#8217;m on Facebook, as Thomas J Raef. You can ping me on Messenger. Like I said, I&#8217;m active in a lot of the Facebook WordPress groups, the admin bar, places like that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Pretty easy to find. I always like talking. Ping me, look me up. Get a hold of me. We&#8217;ll talk.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:45:51] <strong>Nathan Wrigley:</strong> Thank you. Well, the ones that you mentioned, I will make sure to put into the show notes, but thank you so much for giving us that interesting information from the data that you gathered over the year 2023. Really fascinating. And Thomas, I appreciate you coming on the podcast and chatting to me today. Thank you so much.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>[00:46:08] <strong>Thomas J. Raef:</strong> Thank you, Nathan. It&#8217;s always a pleasure chatting with you. Be well my friend.</p>\n</div>\n\n\n\n<p>On the podcast today we have Thomas J. Raef.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Thomas is the founder of We Watch Your Website, a company that has been removing malware from websites since 2007. During that time he’s seen many changes in the methods hackers use to take over a website, and that’s the focus of the podcast today.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>With hackers becoming increasingly agile in their tactics, targeting everything from plugins to session cookies, Thomas brings to the table data he’s gathered from 2023 that puts the spotlight on the evolving digital threat landscape.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>He explains how the system that he runs is able to gather a very large dataset about WordPress websites in real time. Recording data directly from the server, he’s devised systems which make sense of this data. He’s able to turn back the clock, and trace the stack of circumstances which lead to a website being compromised.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We’re all used to hearing that plugins, themes, and sometimes WordPress Core, are the most likely culprits when something goes wrong. The story goes that out of date code, or a zero day is discovered and leveraged. Whilst Thomas does not doubt that this is true, he’s here to paint a somewhat different picture. A picture which puts the focus upon stolen session cookies as the most important factor in website attacks last year.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Thomas explains what session cookies are, and why they unlock so much potential for a hacker. He tells us about the ways that session cookies are harvested, and ways that you can mitigate the problem.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>If you&#8217;ve ever been concerned about the security of your WordPress site or intrigued by the intricacies of cybersecurity, this episode is for you.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Useful links</h2>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"https://wewatchyourwebsite.com/\">We Watch Your Website</a></p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"https://www.kaspersky.com/blog/cybersecurity-history-iloveyou/45001/\">ILOVEYOU worm</a></p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"https://cyber.harvard.edu/newsroom/BadwareBusters\">Badware Busters</a></p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"https://wewatchyourwebsite.com/the-real-attack-vector-responsible-for-60-of-hacked-wordpress-sites-in-2023/\">The Real Attack Vector Responsible for 60% of Hacked WordPress Sites in 2023</a></p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"https://www.scylladb.com/\">ScyllaDB</a></p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"https://fortress.snicco.io/\">Snicco Fortress</a></p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"https://solidwp.com/security/\">Solid Security</a></p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Wed, 28 Feb 2024 18:27:39 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:14:\"Nathan Wrigley\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:40;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:108:\"WPTavern: ‘Support Inclusion in Tech’ is Fundraising to Sponsor More Marginalized WordPress Contributors\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154423\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:113:\"https://wptavern.com/support-inclusion-in-tech-is-fundraising-to-sponsor-more-marginalized-wordpress-contributors\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:3235:\"<p>Support Inclusion in Tech (SiNC) is now fundraising on the <a href=\"https://opencollective.com/support-inclusion-in-tech\">Open Collective (OC) Foundation</a>’s platform. Founded and spearheaded by <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/planningwrite/\">Winstina Hughes</a>, SiNC assists underrepresented WordPress contributors and provides financial support to WordCamp speakers for travel and hotels.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">What is SiNC?</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>SiNC was proposed by Winstina Hughes in 2022 to mitigate the financial stress of underrepresented groups seeking to participate in WordPress events and was first tried in<a href=\"https://wptavern.com/wordcamp-us-trials-new-program-connecting-underrepresented-speakers-with-sponsors-for-travel-and-lodging-costs\"> WordCamp US 2022</a>. She advocates for a 5th freedom, envisioning “the freedom to experience a thriving community truly open to everyone through sharing of information about The WordPress Open Source Project at community events.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Interested candidates seeking travel and/or lodging assistance can confidentially register on the <a href=\"https://supportinclusionintech.com/apply-for-support/\">SiNC website</a>, entering an anonymous directory listing. SiNC then pairs them with sponsors who provide financial assistance by reimbursing necessary amounts. SiNC currently provides a Mentorship Program to all speaker applicants.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Last year, 60% of applicants received assistance, and <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/shan003/\">Sharon Norah</a>, the co-lead for the WordPress Kampala community, became SiNC&#8217;s inaugural sponsored WordPress contributor.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Fundraising on Open Collective Foundation’s Platform</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>February is Black History Month and is the perfect opportunity to find long-term solutions to support the marginalized. Those interested can make one-time contributions to sponsor a speaker&#8217;s travel and/or accommodations. Winstina Hughes has been approached to explore expanding support to speakers participating in WordPress conferences beyond WordCamps.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I reached out to Winstina, and this is what she had to say: “If absolute transparency speaks to your heart, this is my way to honor your donation and impact as we work together to reduce barriers to the full inclusion of underrepresented speakers worldwide,&#8221;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>SiNC&#8217;s fundraising effort deserves recognition, especially in the current climate where <a href=\"https://www.cnbc.com/2024/01/14/as-diversity-equity-and-inclusion-comes-under-legal-attack-companies-quietly-alter-their-programs.html\">companies face scrutiny</a> for their diversity, equity, and inclusion programs, prompting many to reconsider and rebrand their initiatives.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We hope SiNC&#8217;s fundraising initiative succeeds, especially considering the discontinuation of another notable WordCamp assistance program, <a href=\"https://donatewc.org/\">DonateWC by Ines van Dijk</a>, due to the lack of a volunteer team. Rob Howard’s suggestion for <a href=\"https://masterwp.com/wordcamp-speakers-need-to-get-paid/\">paying all WordCamp speakers</a> is also yet to become a reality.&nbsp;</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Wed, 28 Feb 2024 10:51:56 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:7:\"Jyolsna\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:41;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:73:\"Do The Woo Community: WooCommerce Plugins for Portugal with Marco Almeida\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:28:\"https://dothewoo.io/?p=79152\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:72:\"https://dothewoo.io/woocommerce-plugins-for-portugal-with-marco-almeida/\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:417:\"<p>Marco Almeida, WordPress and Woo plugin developer, talks about the niche of building WooCommerce plugins to meet the needs in Portugal.</p>\n<p>&gt;&gt; The post <a href=\"https://dothewoo.io/woocommerce-plugins-for-portugal-with-marco-almeida/\">WooCommerce Plugins for Portugal with Marco Almeida</a> appeared first on <a href=\"https://dothewoo.io\">Do the Woo - a WooCommerce and WordPress Builder Podcast</a>	.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Wed, 28 Feb 2024 09:26:00 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:5:\"BobWP\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:42;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:81:\"WPTavern: The Perils of Hiring: A Cautionary Tale from A WordPress Business Owner\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154408\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:91:\"https://wptavern.com/the-perils-of-hiring-a-cautionary-tale-from-a-wordpress-business-owner\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:5607:\"<p>After being in the WordPress world for 15 years, I’ve made some incredible friendships and I’ve heard some crazy stories in regards to their WordPress business. Recently one of those friends reached out to share his latest experience, and I’m here to say it is one of the crazier ones. For privacy reasons, I’ve changed the names of both parties as well as the name of the agency.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><br /><strong>Introduction:</strong></h2>\n\n\n\n<p>As we all know, starting a business is not for the faint of heart. The statistics can be depressing as 20% of businesses fail within the first 2 years. Beating those stats and growing has become even more rare. After 10 years of being in business,finding and retaining skilled employees and developers has been the bane of Mike’s business growth, which is a crucial aspect of success for any agency. Mike as the lead developer and owner of WebEase, a US-based WordPress service agency, has recently had a lesson for others navigating the hiring landscape.<br /></p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><strong>Background</strong>:</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>WebEase currently has a standard slate of full-time employees in various roles including, sales, marketing, customer support, operations, and design. What’s missing is another developer, as Mike is both owner and lead developer, building the business from the ground up. With the current situation as it is, Mike has struggled to keep up with adding needed features to the service, as well as customer requests, leading him to explore the option of hiring a senior developer to ease the workload.<br /></p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><strong>The LinkedIn Connection:</strong></h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Enter Dave, a senior developer Mike discovered through <a href=\"https://www.linkedin.com/\">LinkedIn</a> who was “open to work”. After a few LinkedIn messages, emails, and finally an official interview via Zoom, Mike offered Dave the job. The onboarding process went smoothly, and Dave appeared to be a perfect fit for the team, wasting no time in getting the required software stack set up and installed per Mike’s instructions. However, within just two weeks, red flags began to surface, with communication becoming a significant issue. Dave remained unresponsive on all channels, causing concern from Mike. <br /></p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><strong>The Shocking Revelation:</strong></h2>\n\n\n\n<p>The situation took a dramatic turn when a third party from Ukraine contacted Mike via the website’s Contact Us form. They were claiming that they had not received payment for work performed for WebEase. At this point, Mike was a bit confused. Who were these people in the Ukraine? They did reference Dave in the contact form, but Mike was honestly baffled at that moment. To Mike&#8217;s surprise, it was revealed that Dave had subcontracted the work to an overseas company without informing anyone at WebEase.<br /></p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><strong>Digging Deeper:</strong></h2>\n\n\n\n<p>To understand the extent of the situation, Mike logged into the company&#8217;s <a href=\"https://github.com/\">GitHub</a> repo with <a href=\"https://code.visualstudio.com/\">VS Code</a> and utilized the <a href=\"https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items?itemName=waderyan.gitblame\">Git Blame</a> tool. This revealed the true scope of the situation, leaving Mike not only concerned about missed deadlines but also alarmed by the unknown developers who had gained access to WebEase&#8217;s codebase. Had they added code that could leave his customers exposed in any capacity? Realizing the severity of the situation, Mike took swift action, halting the outstanding payments to Dave(Mike pays his contracts using a credit card), informing Dave of what he had found, and emphasizing the potential irreparable damage to the sale of his company, which is currently in negotiations with a valuation starting at 6 million USD. In response, Dave denied any wrongdoing but faced with undeniable evidence, threatened legal action against WebEase. Mike stood his ground, asserting that Dave’s actions constituted fraud and posed a significant threat to the integrity of WebEase&#8217;s source code.<br /></p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><strong>The Aftermath:</strong></h2>\n\n\n\n<p>After documenting the entire situation with numerous screenshots of the emails between them, Mike&#8217;s credit card company sided with him, halting all payments to Dave as well as performing a chargeback for a few charges that had already been processed. Despite Dave’s initial defiance, he eventually went silent once again, not only leaving Mike to reflect on the red flags he had missed during the hiring process but also having to schedule time to review any code that was touched by Dave and the subcontracted developers. <br /></p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><strong>Conclusion:</strong></h2>\n\n\n\n<p>So, where is Mike now? He is still searching for that honest senior developer though sadly, he has fallen further behind on adding features that would benefit his customers as code review takes time.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Additionally, it turns out that Mike is not alone with this experience as there are just too many bad actors out there trying to make a quick buck and take advantage of over worked business owners.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>My hope is that other business owners/WordPress agencies can learn from Mike&#8217;s story, emphasizing the importance of due diligence, effective communication, and a vigilant approach to safeguarding the integrity of their codebase and business operations.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Wed, 28 Feb 2024 01:15:00 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:11:\"Adam Silver\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:43;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:86:\"WPTavern: WordPress Photo Festival 2024, A Five Part Retrospective, Part 2, Volunteers\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154383\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:94:\"https://wptavern.com/wordpress-photo-festival-2024-a-five-part-retrospective-part-2-volunteers\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31923:\"<p>From February 3-10 the Kerala, India WordPress community hosted an International Photos event, to both boost the number of photos at https://wordpress.org/photos as well as increase the number of contributors.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>In this series we&#8217;ll talk with organizers, volunteers, and participants about how the event went as well as the community team, about how this event is a model for the second generation WordPress events.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>In this particular we&#8217;ll meet volunteers Sadie-Michaela, Chetan, and Yogesh.</strong></p>\n\n\n\n<p>This article is available in Video, Audio, and transcribed text.</p>\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n<p>Audio Edition</p>\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Transcription</h2>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:00:00]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Welcome to day two of our series on the WP Photos event that happened earlier this month. In this episode, we&#8217;re going to be talking to several volunteers. People that helped out to make the whole event happen very smoothly. I was very impressed as I talked to them to learn how tasks were dealt out and how much fun they had doing it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And how free they were to take part in the event while still being volunteers. We&#8217;re going to start today with Sadie. All right, welcome. Could you tell me your name and where you&#8217;re from?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:00:53]</span> <strong>Sadie-Michaela:</strong> I&#8217;m Sadie and I&#8217;m from the Scottish Highlands. Sadie Michaela Harris. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:00:58]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Ah, the Scottish Highlands. Is that them <span>[00:01:00]</span> behind you in your screenshot?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:01]</span> <strong>Sadie-Michaela:</strong> Yes, right behind me in my screenshot. That&#8217;s Loch Glascarnoch just down the road from where I live. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:05]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> That&#8217;s beautiful. You are blessed to live in such a wonderful place.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:10]</span> <strong>Sadie-Michaela:</strong> I just said it is very lovely, very beautiful. I do feel very blessed. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:14]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Um, so we&#8217;re here to talk today about volunteering for the, um, international photos event that took place recently.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And you were a volunteer, correct? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:25]</span> <strong>Sadie-Michaela:</strong> I was a volunteer. Yeah, volunteer for the photos festival in Kerala. Yeah, earlier this month. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:33]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> What were your tasks? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:36]</span> <strong>Sadie-Michaela:</strong> I made I moderated photos. And I made a short video about how to for people that were new to the photo directory, and how to upload and start sending in their contributions, I guess would be the way to describe it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:52]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> All right, that sounds really cool. Little tutorial. Yeah. Oh, yeah, I didn&#8217;t know you made videos. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:59]</span> <strong>Sadie-Michaela:</strong> <span>[00:02:00]</span> I don&#8217;t normally I just they asked could I do it? So I just thought </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:02:04]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Well, there you are. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:02:04]</span> <strong>Sadie-Michaela:</strong> I had to follow screenshots and stuff to, yeah, screenshots and talk, talk through it and then share the shots on the, on the same, um, blog post that we added it to.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So, yeah, it was, it was an amateurish job. Do pop by and have a look. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:02:17]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> I will. What do you think? Um, have you volunteered at a remote event before?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:02:22]</span> <strong>Sadie-Michaela:</strong> Oh, sorry. I&#8217;ve volunteered, but nothing to do with WordPress. I&#8217;ve done other things, but my roles in other things, but nothing to do with WordPress, it was my absolute first, um, first, first opportunity to do that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So yeah, it was good fun. What did you think? I really enjoyed it. Um, I met obviously the people that I didn&#8217;t know before that were part of it chatting behind the scenes, um, the guys over in India and. We had a prolific amount of, uh, photos that were submitted. It&#8217;s certainly over, I definitely over 1500. I don&#8217;t know.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>It was really, it was a really successful <span>[00:03:00]</span> event. I felt and, uh, so many different, um, photographs, you know, as it always is, but, um, yeah, just really good, really, really positive people were engaging on social media or. Twitter mainly that I saw it shared on, um, so yeah, it was nice. People got involved and it swelled the directory for people to use on WordPress.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:03:19]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Did you interact much with other volunteers? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:03:28]</span> <strong>Sadie-Michaela:</strong> I interacted more, just a couple, couple of them with the guys that actually were running it. Um, and not so much hugely outside of that because, um, probably to do with different time zones of where we all are. So on times when I had some time to moderate on photos or get involved with things.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Not so much beforehand. Um, a little bit with the, the main guy that was, or, um, organizing it that I was interacting with, um, okay. Out there in Kerala. And, uh, he was the one that said, oh, you <span>[00:04:00]</span> know, can you, can you make a video for this? So that was, you know, sort of things that were happening behind the scenes and just messaging back and forth on Slack about what was coming up in the few days that were in the runup to the event.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yeah. Um, blocks going up and stuff like that. You know, there was a special website for the, for the event. Um. On the Word camp site. And, uh, yeah, it was just, um, people slowly contributing bits of other things. There were other people that had made videos on different kind of topics as well. So, yeah. All right.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:04:29]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Um, the reason I&#8217;m asking these questions is because in a, in an in-person event, the volunteers often have a meeting at the beginning where they&#8217;re all together and then they work together, is in the halls and, and all of that. And it is a very different thing with, uh, a remote event. Um, did you feel well supported?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Like you had everything you needed to do? The tasks that were set before you? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:04:51]</span> <strong>Sadie-Michaela:</strong> Yeah, I think so. I mean, the only tasks really I was doing was that I made the video ahead of time and moderating photos. And I do <span>[00:05:00]</span> that anyway outside of the event for the directory. So I didn&#8217;t feel it was, um, yeah, I didn&#8217;t feel anything really unnatural at all, I have to say.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yeah, it was. It was good. Yeah, I don&#8217;t know. Maybe it&#8217;s I guess maybe it depends on the kind of person you are. And if you need reassurance, I could say that from my own side, I work for my own quite independent. So somebody else might, especially if they&#8217;ve been at an in person event, may find it a little bit different, shall we say, but not from I found it fine.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:05:34]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. All right. Um, yeah, I&#8217;ve been quite encouraged by all that I&#8217;ve heard from from everyone who&#8217;s volunteered. Um, it, it went well, um, the post pandemic events and some post pandemic events have really changed how, uh, remote events work, the quality, um, the, the significance and <span>[00:06:00]</span> things like that. It used to be a remote event was kind of slapdash.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>You know, everybody get on zoom and we&#8217;ll talk for a while and we&#8217;re done and they&#8217;re quite different. Now. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:06:13]</span> <strong>Sadie-Michaela:</strong> No, I completely agree. Even things, you know, in a smaller environment here where I am, I&#8217;m a community counselor and we&#8217;ve we held all our meetings because we needed to during the pandemic by zoom.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Um, and we&#8217;ve, we&#8217;ve continued on because we, we live great distances apart and our area is so big. So especially during the winter months, it&#8217;s hugely helped have it going more professional and doing via zoom and teams and stuff. It&#8217;s really been helpful. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:06:43]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. Well, that&#8217;s really great. Uh, would you do it again?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:06:50]</span> <strong>Sadie-Michaela:</strong> Oh, definitely. Yeah, absolutely. I would. Yeah. I jumped on this one because it was, um, photo specific and I do, you know, I&#8217;m a prolific photo taker. Um, So <span>[00:07:00]</span> I like being involved in that. Um, but I would definitely, I wanted to go to a WordCamp and I thought there was going to be one, um, in England actually, although I&#8217;m up in Scotland.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>But it, it was advertised for a date last year and then it never materialised. So I&#8217;m not sure what happened with that. Yeah, it would be lovely to have something like that in Inverness. I would champion. Oh yes. Inverness, yeah, beautiful part of the world. And yeah, plenty of WordPress users up here. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:07:27]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Well.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>All you have to do is apply. Maybe I&#8217;ll You could be, you could be able to eat organizer. Yeah. Maybe I&#8217;ll, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:07:36]</span> <strong>Sadie-Michaela:</strong> maybe I&#8217;ll, how far in? I found they seem to be quite well planned. I know that those, um, word Camp Europe, for example, um, is Oh, yes. Upcoming. Been in the planning. Well, I guess at least since the last one that, um, took place.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Mm-Hmm. . Yeah. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:07:52]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Do you plan WordCamp Europe? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:07:54]</span> <strong>Sadie-Michaela:</strong> I&#8217;m, like this, I&#8217;m quite busy and it&#8217;s quite far away, um, from where I am. So, <span>[00:08:00]</span> never say never, because I don&#8217;t ever say ever, but, um, never. It would be fun. It would be fun to make and stay a few days either side. Yeah. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:08:11]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. Uh, well, I very much appreciate your time. I, uh, I&#8217;m excited to hear about your volunteering and how it went.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And I&#8217;m excited to hear that you liked it and, and we&#8217;ll come back. Uh, do you have any advice for anybody else? Uh, both, both for bonus events and just regular remote events, uh, for </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:08:32]</span> <strong>Sadie-Michaela:</strong> volunteering. I would just say jump in and get involved and enjoy it. You&#8217;re sure to enjoy it. Um, yeah. Friendly, just jump in, have a go, give it a go would be my, my advice.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:08:46]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> After I finished talking with Sadie, I talked with Chetan from India. All right. I&#8217;m here with Chetan. And, uh, did you tell me your, your full name and where you live? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:08:59]</span> <strong>Chetan:</strong> Hi, <span>[00:09:00]</span> I&#8217;m Chetan Trizavati. I&#8217;m living in Ahmedabad, it is in India. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:09:05]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> All right. Um, how far from Kerala? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:09:10]</span> <strong>Chetan:</strong> It&#8217;s like, uh, around two hours flight from here.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:09:14]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> So, yeah. All right. That&#8217;s quite a ways. And, uh, you were a volunteer at the photos event? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:09:23]</span> <strong>Chetan:</strong> Uh, yes, uh, I was a volunteer. I was helped to write the content in our local language. So people in our local language can understand how to contribute in Photo Festival.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:09:35]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Sure. I heard that a lot of the documentation was in many languages.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yeah. Um, and you&#8217;re the first person I&#8217;ve met who actually wrote that. Um, what language was it? It was in Gujarati. Okay. Um, that&#8217;s really, that&#8217;s really cool.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:09:50]</span> <strong>Chetan:</strong> That&#8217;s one of the things I admire about this event is that it was mostly people know, uh, they want to contribute, they don&#8217;t know how to start. So it will <span>[00:10:00]</span> help a local contributor </p>\n\n\n\n<p>as well.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:10:03]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Sure. Um, what other roles did you have? Or was that it?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:10:12]</span> <strong>Chetan:</strong> So, uh, I was, uh, like, uh, contributing to our, uh, community as well. So I, uh, more about the local community. They can participate. So, uh, I was, uh, like, uh, helping other contributors as well. Okay. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:10:30]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Um, I was, uh, this is, this is a virtual event and at, at, um, in person events, a lot of times the volunteers are near each other, they hang out, they go to dinner for, you know, to get together.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>That doesn&#8217;t happen with virtual. Did you spend any time working with any other volunteers? Or were you just on your own most of the time? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:10:52]</span> <strong>Chetan:</strong> Uh, uh, in virtual we don&#8217;t spend as much time like in physical event. But, uh, whatever you have a question, we directly <span>[00:11:00]</span> ask in our chatting or like we facing this issue.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>How can we help? So it is more like a connection on our messaging. Okay. That makes sense. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:11:13]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Um, I, I am a strong proponent of both in person and virtual events for different reasons, and they both have their benefits and drawbacks. And I think one of the drawbacks is that the volunteers don&#8217;t get to assemble in one place and share and things like that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Um, but it still sounds like it was a good event. Did you, did you have a good time and, and you would take place again? You would do it again? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:11:38]</span> <strong>Chetan:</strong> Yes, definitely. Because it&#8217;s a nice initiative to contribute so people can, they can upload whatever their creativity. Also, they want the good price. So they&#8217;re more encouraged by their contribution as well?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:11:52]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yes. Uh, did you contribute photos? Yes, I did. How many? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:11:59]</span> <strong>Chetan:</strong> Yeah. <span>[00:12:00]</span> Yeah. I, I.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>16 photos were, uh, selected and with the WP Kerala because there are many photos in pending. So people are running with the photos. So we have to wait for our photos. Uh, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:12:19]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> right. Yes. Yes. Yes. Um, did you seek out the role of volunteer or did someone come to you and say, please, will you volunteer? Um, um, did you go seeking the role of volunteer?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Or did someone come to you and ask you to be a volunteer? Uh, uh, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:12:42]</span> <strong>Chetan:</strong> actually the lead organizer was, uh, asked me to help. How can, uh, how can we help? So I said, I definitely can help. So, uh, in our local community, because we have one of the large community in India. So it was, uh, uh, very good opportunity to <span>[00:13:00]</span> contribute for them.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I ask them, whatever I can do, I&#8217;ll definitely </p>\n\n\n\n<p>help them.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:13:08]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Excuse me. It sounds like they did a really good job reaching out because they reached out to me as well, and I know they reached out to other people around the world and I think that&#8217;s kind of kind of key, rather than wait for people to show up and say, here I&#8217;m going to work.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yeah, to actually reach out and ask.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:13:23]</span> <strong>Chetan:</strong> Yeah, because sometimes people don&#8217;t know how to contribute because if, uh, if he had the, I don&#8217;t know, there is voluntary as well, because mostly in what you live in the, we hardly find volunteers, but he come to me that he needs help to promote the event. So it was really good.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>They need to do the core guys can contact all the people to help them. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:13:46]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Sure. Yeah. My, my talk at WordCamp Asia last year was, was titled the power in the asking. Um, yeah, there is power in asking people to help. That&#8217;s always help. Yes. Yeah. <span>[00:14:00]</span> That&#8217;s always help. Yeah. Um, do you have any advice? Do you have any advice for people doing just virtual events, working, working virtual events?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:14:12]</span> <strong>Chetan:</strong> Uh, for that they have to communicate like, uh, Uh, creating a post that they can, uh, get idea what is going to happen on each day with it. Because in virtual people, uh, don&#8217;t get usually the focus on the time, but for example, physical there are physical available in virtual, they can live in between of the time.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So the, they have to be some, uh, good ideas, some good creativity so they can, uh, attract more. How can that, that even get helpful or they can even contribute for themselves. Okay, that&#8217;s great. For example, for example, the photo festival, they have a good prizes. So people increase more, they can contribute as more as photos.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So they can, in reward, they can also <span>[00:15:00]</span> get some prizes. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:15:02]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Okay. Do you have any advice for someone who might do another photos event like this? So imagine if it were not done at Kerala. Some, some other groups that were going to do the same thing. What would you tell them?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:15:14]</span> <strong>Chetan:</strong> Oh, yeah. So, uh, in one they have to, uh, ask, uh, many volunteers.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>They can, uh, help to approve photos because in the, uh, in this event we are faced like a lot of people are waiting to approve their photos. Also, some sometime takes, were notating adding, but we all know that this is contributor as a volunteer because we have to wait as well. So in advance, if we can ask other people to contribute to like, uh, approval photos.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So they can have a good amount of people they can help to upload photos so other people can contribute. So in less time they can get approval for the photos as well. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:15:53]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Okay. That&#8217;s pretty great. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:15:56]</span> <strong>Chetan:</strong> Um, I&#8217;m excited to see more <span>[00:16:00]</span> photo events. Uh, I think it&#8217;s pretty ideal for a virtual event. Um, and I&#8217;d like to see They have almost 12, 000 photos submitted in this event.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:16:10]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Ah, yeah. Um, I like that it was based in a city but not Only in that city. So this one was Kerala. I&#8217;d like to see one in, uh, Sydney, Australia, or I&#8217;d like to see one, you know, any, any other city, um, and then see a bounce around the world to see how each city presents sort of like the Olympics or, or a global work camp.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>You know what I mean? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:16:42]</span> <strong>Chetan:</strong> Yeah, it is like a city, but, uh, in Kerala is state. So, uh, for example, Kochi has a word game, but at this time, Yeah, this is the Kerala Photo Festival, so it is based on the street, but, uh, it is virtually one, so anyone can participate, <span>[00:17:00]</span> so mostly people have participated as much as they can.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:17:06]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yes. Well, thank you for your time. This has been really helpful. I&#8217;m excited to include you in my story. Thank you so much. My final volunteer for this episode is Yogesh. Hello there, can you tell me your full name and where you live? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:17:24]</span> <strong>Yogesh:</strong> Okay, my name is Yogesh, Yogesh Londe. I live in Bangalore, India. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:17:31]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> And where&#8217;s Bangalore, generally speaking?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>North? South? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:17:35]</span> <strong>Yogesh:</strong> Bangalore is south of India. It&#8217;s like right in the middle of the southern, towards the southern tip of India. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:17:43]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Oh, okay. The warm </p>\n\n\n\n<p>part.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:17:46]</span> <strong>Yogesh:</strong> Lovely, yeah. It&#8217;s warm part, but because of our altitude, we have cooler weather. Whenever it rains, whenever we have humidity, it&#8217;s lovely weather. It&#8217;s the city of perpetual springs.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Ah, <span>[00:18:00]</span> well, that sounds like a great place to visit. You should, yes, definitely. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:18:05]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> All right. Well, we&#8217;re here today to talk about your role as a volunteer in the recent WP Photos event. Um, so let&#8217;s just dive right in. What was your task as a volunteer? What did you volunteer to do? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:18:20]</span> <strong>Yogesh:</strong> Yeah, as a volunteer? Um, as a volunteer, uh, for the photo, uh, WP Photo , I was, my only task was to al uh, the attendees on the Zoom call at the inaugural and at the, it&#8217;s a tiny task, but I love doing it because it was, I was contributing to.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>That&#8217;s fantastic event that we sure. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:18:49]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. Something I noticed on the, on the page for volunteers. There are many, many volunteers and from the ones I&#8217;ve talked to, they each had a very small job, which I kind of like because. <span>[00:19:00]</span> Yeah, it allows volunteers to, to be full attendees and not have to work the whole time.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Um, but why did you get, why did you, uh, did you get selected for that job or did you choose that job? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:13]</span> <strong>Yogesh:</strong> I chose that job. I volunteered, uh, to do something for the WPS and I was, I was selected for this. Okay. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:28]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> All right. Um, have you volunteered at a remote event before? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:36]</span> <strong>Yogesh:</strong> I did volunteer, uh, remote event before with you.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>One of the events was with you. The. Yes. Uh, word Fest Live, which went Yes. Word </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:50]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Fest. Yeah, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:52]</span> <strong>Yogesh:</strong> word Live twice. And, uh, I was an organizer at Word Camp India, uh, 2021. It was <span>[00:20:00]</span> online year, remotely. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:20:01]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Oh, I remember that. Yeah. Um, how does, how does this event compare? &#8217;cause those are, well, I guess, uh, one was a word camp word dress was not a camp.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Um, although it felt like one, um, how does it compare? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:20:17]</span> <strong>Yogesh:</strong> Oh, well, this one is a very unique event. The focus was only on contributing to WordPress photo directory. And that&#8217;s a fantastic way to contribute to an open source project, especially, specifically WordPress. So the entry bar is quite low, so anybody can participate, anybody can take a lovely photo and, uh, share it with the world saying that I took this photo and you can use it the way you like.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And that&#8217;s the only condition to contribute to WordPress photo directory. <span>[00:21:00]</span> And that was, um, that was what the whole WP Photo Kerala was about. So. That way, the, the, the aim of the program was, uh, contributing to WordPress Photos. So that way, the work that I was supposed to do was very little, minimal work, and it was very easy, but enjoyable.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:21:26]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> I&#8217;m really glad to hear that. Um, you know, I&#8217;ve been working on this story for a week and a half now, and I&#8217;m just now realizing how non exclusive, how inclusive this event was, um, a word camp by its very nature is exclusive. You pick 20 speakers and everybody else. Doesn&#8217;t take part. But with, with this photos event, every single person who showed up could <span>[00:22:00]</span> totally take part.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:22:02]</span> <strong>Yogesh:</strong> Everybody is&#8230; it&#8217;s everybody&#8217;s event. My event is organized this event. I, I also clicked some photos and I contributed during this event. Um, yeah, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:22:13]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> well, that&#8217;s really cool. Um, was there, uh, what was internal communication like? Between volunteers, between volunteers and organizers, et cetera. Was there an organized system or was it just kind of track people down as you, as you need?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:22:38]</span> <strong>Yogesh:</strong> Um, I, I&#8217;m not sure I was not on any of the, I, I&#8217;m not sure if the organizing team has their own Slack channel or anything, but, uh, I am, I communicated with the organizing team over, uh, uh, make WP Slack. And <span>[00:23:00]</span> whenever they need it, they will get in touch with me over WhatsApp or phone call because I&#8217;m, uh, I&#8217;m regularly in touch with them.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And so I was given a primer what my role was. This is what you&#8217;re supposed to do. And if you need help, just contact me. And since my task was very minimal, so I didn&#8217;t need the specialized training or anything. And so I was just doing that task with Marshall. Muting or, uh, asking them to, you know, uh, turn on their microphones.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So those, those were simple tasks, which I am already well aware of. So I did not need much. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:23:45]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> All right. Um, I&#8217;ve been, as I&#8217;ve been watching the event, that&#8217;s like. I didn&#8217;t watch the event very well. I was ill, but I&#8217;m looking back at it and I&#8217;m trying to think about, <span>[00:24:00]</span> um, what was done and why and how, how it might get done better.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Maybe it&#8217;s perfect. I have noticed some things that are just really spot on and, and couldn&#8217;t be done better. Um, so I&#8217;m trying to decide if better communication is needed. And it sort of sounds like no, from the volunteers I&#8217;ve spoken to, like, no, I just, I was told what to do and I did my thing and, and it&#8217;s all good.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:24:25]</span> <strong>Yogesh:</strong> Communication was just enough, just enough. So it was not overload of, you know, just enough, but, uh, even their, uh, communication over the website was fantastic. That was fantastic. Tell me about that. Attended was fantastic. You know, the, the blog posts on, uh, WP Photos Kerala were, um, was actually how to contribute to WordPress Photos directory.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>In many Indian languages. So, they had Maharashtra, <span>[00:25:00]</span> Tamil, Bengali, Nepali, Marathi. So many languages. So they&#8217;re like, you know, as you said, it was inclusive. Anybody who could, who wanted to learn how to contribute to what this photo directory, they could just go to the website and say, Oh, there is already a post in my own language.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So if I don&#8217;t understand it very well, I could read that post in my own language and understand, yes, that&#8217;s so easy. What am I supposed to do? How do I do it? What are the conditions? And that&#8217;s, that makes sense. So. It&#8217;s, it&#8217;s, uh, it&#8217;s fantastic at many levels. Number one, it makes it inclusive. Everybody&#8217;s welcome.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>No matter what language you speak, which part of India, what language you speak, everybody&#8217;s welcome. Number two is they got the community involved. The people who do only translation, polyglot community. They don&#8217;t do anything. I mean, they might not have the skills to do a <span>[00:26:00]</span> photo edit, uh, photo approvals, uh, other, uh, coding, other things, but they were involved and they became part of it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yeah. And, uh, so they got people excited about, uh, contributing to WordPress by translating, which is interesting. So it went across. Disciplines. Yes. Cross discipline collaboration. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:26:29]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> So I have a question for you. Um, I&#8217;ve made content in the past, targeted at India, and I&#8217;ve considered translating it. But I&#8217;ve been told by many people, I think maybe even by you, that English is all we need.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Oh, yes. People speak English, that it&#8217;s not needed. What made this special? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:26:49]</span> <strong>Yogesh:</strong> So, okay. Now, that&#8217;s, you&#8217;re right. So English is all we need when we come to WordPress dashboard. Or, uh, website menu, or, uh, <span>[00:27:00]</span> contact us page, or, uh, about us, uh, con, contact details. But when you want, when you want to tell the story, or when you want to give detailed instructions, uh, there are people who will benefit reading it in their own mother tongue.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So, as, as, uh, as I, I&#8217;m saying. In case of Heropress, there are some essays which are already written by the author in their own mother tongue and in English. So, I like to read the essays, for example, in Marathi. I like to read the essays, for example, in some of the languages, like Persian. So, those essays, as you said previously, when people write in their own mother tongue.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>There&#8217;s no accent. Or when I&#8217;m reading in somebody&#8217;s mother tongue, that essay is without any accent. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:27:55]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yes. There&#8217;s no accent when you write in your own mother tongue.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:27:59]</span> <strong>Yogesh:</strong> That&#8217;s true. <span>[00:28:00]</span> That&#8217;s true. That&#8217;s true. So I enjoy reading stories when people tell stories, narrate stories in their own mother tongue. That&#8217;s special.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Same way, um, the documentation should be in the mother tongue because there are terms which people understand better in their own mother tongue. So for me, yes, I, I would read documentation predominantly in English, my first choice would be already English because I&#8217;ve always been doing that. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:32]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> So, right.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>There are many people that makes good sense.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:42]</span> <strong>Yogesh:</strong> And so that, that way that it did make it special this time, yes. </p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yeah. And I, you know, I&#8217;ve had other people say that even if their English is excellent, knowing the other person took the time to translate it for their convenience <span>[00:29:00]</span> is special. Oh, </p>\n\n\n\n<p>yes. Oh, yes. Yes. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:29:10]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> All right. Uh, I don&#8217;t have any more questions for you.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I really appreciate your time. Thank you for coming. Thank you for taking part in the photos project.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:29:18]</span> <strong>Yogesh:</strong> Uh, lovely chatting with you. I have enjoyed talking to you. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:29:23]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. And that brings us to the end of day two of our series about the WP photos project that took place internationally. Today, we spoke with volunteers tomorrow.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We talked with some attendees and find out what it was like to go to an event where you didn&#8217;t necessarily rub elbows with anyone else, but everybody was there. See you tomorrow.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Tue, 27 Feb 2024 21:28:06 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:14:\"Topher DeRosia\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:44;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:53:\"Gravatar: Gravatar Manifesto: One Profile, Everywhere\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:32:\"http://blog.gravatar.com/?p=1057\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:79:\"https://blog.gravatar.com/2024/02/27/gravatar-manifesto-one-profile-everywhere/\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:5744:\"<p class=\"has-medium-font-size\">Beyond the avatar with new, open-source tools</p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"has-small-font-size\">Gravatar has been a humble profile picture service for over two decades. Your globally recognized avatar, linked to an email address, traveling with you around the web.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"has-small-font-size\">With many <em>billions</em> of avatars served across sites like WordPress.com, Slack, GitHub, and ChatGPT.</p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"has-small-font-size\">We want to give you a preview of the next evolution of Gravatar. Building on our legacy by empowering users to claim control of their digital identities and equipping developers with the open-source tools they need to build a better web.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">A New Approach to Identity</h2>\n\n\n\n<img width=\"660\" height=\"495\" src=\"https://gravatar.files.wordpress.com/2024/02/image-4-1.png?w=660\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-1195\" />\n\n\n\n<p>Gravatar redefines online identity by linking it to an email address rather than a name. This subtle yet profound difference opens a world of possibilities — allowing you to curate multiple profiles for various facets of your life, whether work, family, or play.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Even be anonymous. We support that, too!</p>\n\n\n\n<p>On sites and apps integrated with Gravatar, easily import and share profile details like your avatar, bio, and interests for a seamless and engaging experience.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Your Online Business Card</h2>\n\n\n\n<img width=\"660\" height=\"495\" src=\"https://gravatar.files.wordpress.com/2024/02/image-5-1.png?w=660\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-1196\" />\n\n\n\n<p>What’s old is new again, and Gravatar is the original ‘link-in-bio’ tool. Every Gravatar account comes with a free public profile page.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>If you haven’t visited your profile in a while, now is an excellent time to check out the recent updates.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Use the convenient QR code to share with those you meet in real life, replacing old-fashioned business cards. Add links to your social accounts, contact information, calendars, payment methods, and more. Look for new integrations and personalization settings in the months to come.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Privacy First Profiles</h2>\n\n\n\n<img width=\"660\" height=\"495\" src=\"https://gravatar.files.wordpress.com/2024/02/image-6-1.png?w=660\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-1197\" />\n\n\n\n<p>With Gravatar, you always decide what information gets shared and when.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>You may choose to have your avatar and display name public. But you may want information like your phone number or your birthday private. Gravatar will ask you to confirm before sharing non-public data with a new site or app. And we’ll soon have tools to help keep up with where profile data is used.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Users set permissions, developers build worry-free.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>A major benefit of Gravatar is that if you need to update any information, you can just do it once.&nbsp; The change is then instantly available to every site you’ve shared it with.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Let’s Kill Passwords</h2>\n\n\n\n<img width=\"660\" height=\"495\" src=\"https://gravatar.files.wordpress.com/2024/02/image-8.png?w=660\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-1198\" />\n\n\n\n<p>We will soon release a new passwordless authentication service that can be added to any website or app. Logging in with Gravatar will be the simplest way to bring your profile with you to new sites and services.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Stolen passwords result in data breaches and identity theft. Passwords are also a pain for all of us to manage, reset, and remember.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Going passwordless with Gravatar&#8217;s oAuth service transforms login experiences by ditching traditional usernames and passwords for a more secure, convenient, and future-proof approach. It eliminates common vulnerabilities and reduces support drama around forgotten passwords or locked-out accounts.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Gravatar&#8217;s authentication prioritizes your security. We use open standards, offer seamless Passkey integration, and provide free, developer-friendly tools (a WordPress plugin, mobile SDKs, and more).&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Powerful APIs For Developers</h2>\n\n\n\n<img width=\"660\" height=\"495\" src=\"https://gravatar.files.wordpress.com/2024/02/image-7-1.png?w=660\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-1199\" />\n\n\n\n<p>Gravatar&#8217;s APIs offer developers unparalleled flexibility and power to customize user experiences using Gravatar profile data.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The existing free API allows for easy implementation of avatars and basic profile details across websites and applications.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Later this year, a new paid API service will extend this functionality with access to more data users have opted to share, including job titles, interests, contact details, and social connections. This expanded dataset will open up new possibilities for developers around e-commerce, CRM, content algorithms, fraud detection, and personalized user experiences.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>End users will always control when and if their data is shared.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>By leveraging Gravatar&#8217;s APIs, developers can significantly reduce user onboarding friction and tap into a vast network of millions of profiles for a more interconnected web experience.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Join Us On This Journey</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Gravatar fosters a more connected, accessible, and user-centric internet.&nbsp;We are just getting started. We’d love to have you along for the ride.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Subscribe to our blog below to be notified of future updates.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Developers, <a href=\"https://docs.gravatar.com/join-beta-waitlist/\">join our beta waitlist</a> for early access to the tools coming soon.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Tue, 27 Feb 2024 16:30:30 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:11:\"Ronnie Burt\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:45;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:40:\"WordPress.org blog: WordPress 6.5 Beta 3\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:35:\"https://wordpress.org/news/?p=16992\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:56:\"https://wordpress.org/news/2024/02/wordpress-6-5-beta-3/\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:8180:\"<p>WordPress 6.5 Beta 3 is here and ready for testing!</p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>This beta version of the WordPress software is under development</strong>. Please do not install, run, or test this version of WordPress on production or mission-critical websites. Instead, it is recommended you evaluate Beta 3 on a test server and site.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>You can test WordPress 6.5 Beta 3 in four ways:</p>\n\n\n\n<table><tbody><tr><th>Plugin</th><td>Install and activate the <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/plugins/wordpress-beta-tester/\">WordPress Beta Tester</a> plugin on a WordPress install. (Select the “Bleeding edge” channel and “Beta/RC Only” stream).</td></tr><tr><th>Direct Download</th><td>Download the <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/wordpress-6.5-beta3.zip\">Beta 3 version (zip)</a> and install it on a WordPress website.</td></tr><tr><th>Command Line</th><td>Use the following <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/cli/\">WP-CLI</a> command:<br /><code>wp core update --version=6.5-beta</code>3</td></tr><tr><th>WordPress Playground</th><td>Use the <a href=\"https://playground.wordpress.net/#{%20%22preferredVersions%22:%20{%20%22php%22:%20%228.0%22,%20%22wp%22:%20%22beta%22%20},%20%22features%22:%20{%20%22networking%22:%20true%20},%20%22steps%22:%20[%20{%20%22step%22:%20%22login%22,%20%22username%22:%20%22admin%22,%20%22password%22:%20%22password%22%20},%20{%20%22step%22:%20%22importFile%22,%20%22file%22:%20{%20%22resource%22:%20%22url%22,%20%22url%22:%20%22https://raw.githubusercontent.com/wpaccessibility/a11y-theme-unit-test/master/a11y-theme-unit-test-data.xml%22%20}%20},%20{%20%22step%22:%20%22importFile%22,%20%22file%22:%20{%20%22resource%22:%20%22url%22,%20%22url%22:%20%22https://raw.githubusercontent.com/WordPress/theme-test-data/master/themeunittestdata.wordpress.xml%22%20}%20},%20{%20%22step%22:%20%22installPlugin%22,%20%22pluginZipFile%22:%20{%20%22resource%22:%20%22wordpress.org/plugins%22,%20%22slug%22:%20%22query-monitor%22%20},%20%22options%22:%20{%20%22activate%22:%20false%20},%20%22progress%22:%20{%20%22weight%22:%202%20}%20},%20{%20%22step%22:%20%22installPlugin%22,%20%22pluginZipFile%22:%20{%20%22resource%22:%20%22wordpress.org/plugins%22,%20%22slug%22:%20%22create-block-theme%22%20},%20%22progress%22:%20{%20%22weight%22:%202%20}%20},%20{%20%22step%22:%20%22installPlugin%22,%20%22pluginZipFile%22:%20{%20%22resource%22:%20%22wordpress.org/plugins%22,%20%22slug%22:%20%22debug-bar%22%20},%20%22progress%22:%20{%20%22weight%22:%202%20}%20},%20{%20%22step%22:%20%22installPlugin%22,%20%22pluginZipFile%22:%20{%20%22resource%22:%20%22wordpress.org/plugins%22,%20%22slug%22:%20%22health-check%22%20},%20%22progress%22:%20{%20%22weight%22:%202%20}%20},%20{%20%22step%22:%20%22installPlugin%22,%20%22pluginZipFile%22:%20{%20%22resource%22:%20%22wordpress.org/plugins%22,%20%22slug%22:%20%22test-reports%22%20},%20%22progress%22:%20{%20%22weight%22:%202%20}%20},%20{%20%22step%22:%20%22installPlugin%22,%20%22pluginZipFile%22:%20{%20%22resource%22:%20%22wordpress.org/plugins%22,%20%22slug%22:%20%22user-switching%22%20},%20%22progress%22:%20{%20%22weight%22:%202%20}%20}%20]%20}\">6.5 Beta 3 WordPress Playground instance</a> to test the software directly in your browser without the need for a separate site or setup.&nbsp;</td></tr></tbody></table>\n\n\n\n<p>The current target date for the final release of WordPress 6.5 is <strong>March 26, 2024</strong>. That&#8217;s only four weeks away! Get an overview of the <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/6-5/\">6.5 release cycle</a>, and check the <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/\">Make WordPress Core blog</a> for <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/tag/6-5/\">6.5-related posts</a> in the coming weeks for more information.</p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"is-style-default\"><strong>Catch up on what&#8217;s new in WordPress 6.5</strong>: <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/news/2024/02/wordpress-6-5-beta-1/\">Read the Beta 1 announcement</a> for details and highlights.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">How to test this release</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Your help testing the WordPress 6.5 Beta 3 version is key to ensuring everything in the release is the best it can be. While testing the upgrade process is essential, trying out new features is equally important. <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/test/2024/02/28/help-test-wordpress-beta-3/\">This detailed guide</a> will walk you through testing features in WordPress 6.5. For those new to testing, follow <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/test/2024/02/15/help-test-wordpress-6-5-beta-1\">this general testing guide</a> for more details on getting set up. </p>\n\n\n\n<p>If you encounter an issue, please report it to the <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/support/forum/alphabeta/\">Alpha/Beta area</a> of the support forums or directly to <a href=\"https://core.trac.wordpress.org/newticket\">WordPress Trac</a> if you are comfortable writing a reproducible bug report. You can also check your issue against a list of <a href=\"https://core.trac.wordpress.org/tickets/major\">known bugs</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Curious about testing releases in general? Follow along with the <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/test/\">testing initiatives in Make Core</a> and join the <a href=\"https://wordpress.slack.com/messages/core-test/\">#core-test channel</a> on <a href=\"https://wordpress.slack.com/\">Making WordPress Slack</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Vulnerability bounty doubles during Beta/RC</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Between Beta 1, released on February 13, and the final Release Candidate (RC) scheduled for March 19, the <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/security/2024/02/12/welcoming-2024-with-wordpress-6-5-beta-1/\">monetary reward for reporting new, unreleased security vulnerabilities</a> is doubled. Please follow responsible disclosure practices as detailed in the project’s security practices and policies outlined on the <a href=\"https://hackerone.com/wordpress\">HackerOne page</a> and in the <a href=\"https://wordpress.org/about/security/\">security white paper</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Beta 3 updates and highlights</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>WordPress 6.5 Beta 3 contains more than 45 updates to the Editor since the Beta 2 release, including more than 35 <a href=\"https://core.trac.wordpress.org/query?status=closed&changetime=02%2F21%2F2024..02%2F27%2F2024&milestone=6.5&col=id&col=milestone&col=owner&col=type&col=priority&order=id\">tickets for WordPress Core</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Each beta cycle focuses on bug fixes; more are on the way with your help through testing. You can browse the technical details for all issues addressed since Beta 2 using these links:</p>\n\n\n\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https://github.com/WordPress/gutenberg/commits/wp/6.5?since=2024-02-21&until=2024-02-27\">GitHub commits for 6.5</a> since February 21</li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https://core.trac.wordpress.org/query?status=closed&changetime=02%2F21%2F2024..02%2F27%2F2024&milestone=6.5&col=id&col=milestone&col=owner&col=type&col=priority&order=id\">Closed Trac tickets</a> since February 21</li>\n</ul>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Double the haiku for Beta 3</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Find a Beta bug,<br />it will help the team a lot,<br />and improve WordPress!<br /><em>&#8211; submitted by</em> <em><a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/lada7042/\" class=\"mention\"><span class=\"mentions-prefix\">@</span>lada7042</a></em></p>\n\n\n\n<p>In code, dreams are bold,<br />WordPress&#8217;s story unfolds,<br />Beta journey&#8217;s told.<br /><em>&#8211; submitted by <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/huzaifaalmesbah/\" class=\"mention\"><span class=\"mentions-prefix\">@</span>huzaifaalmesbah</a></em></p>\n\n\n\n<p><em>Thank you to the following contributors for collaborating on this post: <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/dansoschin/\" class=\"mention\"><span class=\"mentions-prefix\">@</span>dansoschin</a></em>, <em><a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/swissspidy/\" class=\"mention\"><span class=\"mentions-prefix\">@</span>swissspidy</a>, <a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/adarshposimyth/\" class=\"mention\"><span class=\"mentions-prefix\">@</span>adarshposimyth</a></em>, <em><a href=\"https://profiles.wordpress.org/davidbaumwald/\" class=\"mention\"><span class=\"mentions-prefix\">@</span>davidbaumwald</a></em></p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Tue, 27 Feb 2024 16:27:30 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:12:\"Lauren Stein\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:46;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:67:\"WPTavern: FSE Outreach Experimental Loses Two Words, Gains New Life\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154354\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:77:\"https://wptavern.com/fse-outreach-experimental-loses-two-words-gains-new-life\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:7938:\"<p>Sometimes success means having to say goodbye. That’s sort of what happened to the FSE Outreach Program, newly launched as plain <em>Outreach</em>.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The longtime facilitator of this initiative, Automattic Product Wrangler Anne McCarthy, <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2023/09/07/evolving-the-fse-outreach-program/\">announced the upcoming changes</a> in September 2023:</p>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p><em>What started as an</em> <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2020/05/01/an-experimental-outreach-project-for-full-site-editing/\"><em>experimental program in May 2020</em></a><em> with the expectation that the Site Editor would ship in the following 6 or so months turned into nearly 3.5 years of feedback loops, knowledge sharing, and community building. With WordPress 6.3 bringing Phase 2 to completion, it’s time for the FSE Outreach Program to evolve alongside the broader WordPress project and needs.</em></p>\n\n\n\n<p><em>The intention was to “get feedback about pain points to the right people faster and help keep us on track for Phase 2”. We did this! You did this.</em><br /><em>All good things must come to an end–or they need to adapt to continue to stay relevant. </em></p>\n</blockquote>\n\n\n\n<p>It was the culmination of consistent commitment to both expand the scope of testers and to nudge users to experiment with new features:</p>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p><em>The primary goal is to help improve the Full Site Editing experience by gathering feedback from WordPress site builders [&#8230;] the program also seeks to grow awareness and ability with full site editing features.</em></p>\n</blockquote>\n\n\n\n<p>As the adoption of the Site Editor (nee FSE, or Full Site Editing)<a href=\"https://wptavern.com/wordpress-2023-survey-block-editor-on-the-rise-positive-feeling-about-contributing-drops\"> continues to grow</a>, it’s time to refocus on discoverability and redefine the program’s goals.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Extending the Test Team</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>The first step—renaming the Making WordPress Slack channel to<a href=\"https://wordpress.slack.com/archives/C015GUFFC00\"> #outreach</a>—has been completed. But as culture has taught us—from William Shakespeare to failed rebranding endeavors—a new name doesn’t change the nature of the object it delineates.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Birgit Pauli-Haack, leading the new program, sees Outreach as an enablement platform where site builders and extenders collaborate with core developers. With teammates Justin Tadlock and Nick Diego, she’ll coordinate the effort to recalibrate the program to further this partnership and deepen the community’s trust.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>In her <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2024/01/29/proposal-whats-next-for-the-outreach-program/\">proposal post on the Core blog</a>, Pauli-Haack listed several use cases for the rebranded channel, aiming to keep it approachable, friendly, and wide-ranged—a destination for WordPress newcomers and professionals alike.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>“The FSE Outreach program made it clear that connecting in this channel facilitated participants’ first contributions and lowered the barrier to connecting with the open-source project,” says Pauli-Haack, clarifying that “because site builders and extenders regularly intersect, the channel’s content will be relevant to both user groups. There’s a lot of overlap of interests and concerns.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Outreach will be a place to:</p>\n\n\n\n<ol>\n<li>Connect with Developer Hours and Hallway Hangouts presenters beyond the live event.</li>\n\n\n\n<li>Resurface relevant content from the Dev Chat about upcoming features and call for testing from various teams.</li>\n\n\n\n<li>Collect feedback on breaking changes in future releases and provide answers and workarounds.</li>\n\n\n\n<li>Allow design and engineering teams to tap into this extended user base for input on GitHub issues and Trac tickets.</li>\n\n\n\n<li>Arrange ad hoc working groups for issues raised across social media that are outside the scope of the Support team.</li>\n\n\n\n<li>Provide support and resources to Meetup organizers.</li>\n</ol>\n\n\n\n<p>Rather than a link between support and marketing or even a dedicated end-user-oriented developer advocacy initiative, Pauli-Haack thinks of Outreach as an extension of the Test team: “It is part of the open-source process to build the software and close feedback loops, ideally before the next version is released or to help improve the current functionality. It is part of user testing in a broader sense.”</p>\n\n\n\n<p>A welcome side effect of the original program was the comeback of the Test team, whose members now post regular updates and proactively share testing instructions aimed at non-developers.</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">No Bug Reports Needed</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Two comments posted in response to the “What’s next” post echoed a long-standing obstacle, particularly for casual, non-technical contributors: how to encourage them to share feedback while lowering the barrier to entry associated with GitHub.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>How will Outreach address these issues?<br /></strong>“The program is another way for site builders and developers to get comfortable contributing and collaborating on the open-source project. Any constructive and problem-oriented feedback is welcome, especially if it doesn’t fit into the guardrails of a bug report or a feature request. By discussion and collaboration, we discover the next steps to a possible solution.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>It’s also an opportunity for extenders to find an open ear for airing pain points on extending WordPress. Part of the extender Outreach is the Extensibility Issues Triage initiative. Each month, contributors from agencies and extenders go through the project board of identified issues, try to move them forward to get them reviewed and ultimately merged.”</p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">A Group Endeavor</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>In the <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2024/02/23/recap-hallway-hangout-whats-next-for-the-outreach-program/\">recap of the Hallway Hangout</a> dedicated to discussing these typical difficulties and possible ways to alleviate them, the team proposed actionable steps:</p>\n\n\n\n<ul>\n<li>Set up a GitHub team that contributors can ping when they want to gather early feedback from users.</li>\n\n\n\n<li>Encourage engineers to use the Outreach channel to request extenders’ feedback on new features earlier in development before they’re merged and shipped.</li>\n\n\n\n<li>Create a wishlist for upcoming releases to get users’ input on priorities. This overlaps with the <a href=\"https://make.wordpress.org/core/2023/11/27/summary-hallway-hangout-triage-extensibility-issue/\">Extensibility Issues Triage</a> initiative.</li>\n</ul>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p><em>The goal is to make the Outreach Program more accessible and sustainable, improve collaboration across teams, and help guide WordPress development through early and ongoing user and contributor input.</em></p>\n</blockquote>\n\n\n\n<p>Coming up with ideas is the easy part—making them happen is the real challenge. As Pauli-Haack mentioned, “This can only be a group endeavor if we want to broaden the reach and be a welcoming place for people interested in particular focuses of the software.“</p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>How will you ensure that the channel remains focused, and balances sometimes conflicting needs and interests?<br /></strong>“These are ideas that come from knowing that non-contributors need to connect with contributors. We want to ensure an ongoing humming in the channel, letting people know what’s happening. As this is still a young initiative, we will see what will come of it. It’s version one, and we will continue to iterate.”</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Tue, 27 Feb 2024 10:00:53 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:11:\"Ronny Shani\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:47;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:95:\"Do The Woo Community: The Collaboration of the Interactivity API with WordPress and WooCommerce\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:28:\"https://dothewoo.io/?p=79149\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:74:\"https://dothewoo.io/interactivity-api-collaboration-wordpress-woocommerce/\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:481:\"<p>WordPress and WooCommerce devs Carlos Bravo and Lucio Giannotta discuss the collaboration of WordPress core and Woo with the Interactivity API, a new framework for developers.</p>\n<p>&gt;&gt; The post <a href=\"https://dothewoo.io/interactivity-api-collaboration-wordpress-woocommerce/\">The Collaboration of the Interactivity API with WordPress and WooCommerce</a> appeared first on <a href=\"https://dothewoo.io\">Do the Woo - a WooCommerce and WordPress Builder Podcast</a>	.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Tue, 27 Feb 2024 10:00:00 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:5:\"BobWP\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:48;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:86:\"WPTavern: WordPress Photo Festival 2024, A Five Part Retrospective, Part 1, Organizers\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154319\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:94:\"https://wptavern.com/wordpress-photo-festival-2024-a-five-part-retrospective-part-1-organizers\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:39857:\"<p>From February 3-10 the Kerala, India WordPress community hosted an International Photos event, to both boost the number of photos at https://wordpress.org/photos as well as increase the number of contributors.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>In this series we&#8217;ll talk with organizers, volunteers, and participants about how the event went as well as the community team, about how this event is a model for the second generation WordPress events.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>In this particular we&#8217;ll meet organizers Bigul Malayi and Ajith R N.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>This article is available in Video, Audio, and transcribed text.</p>\n\n\n\n<p></p>\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n<p>Audio Edition</p>\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Transcription</h2>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:00:00]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Hello! My name is Topher DeRosia. This episode begins a five part series on the WordPress photo festival, 2024 that took place February three through 10. We&#8217;ll talk to organizers, volunteers, and participants about how the event went as well as the community team, about how this event is a model for the second generation WordPress events.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Before we get started, I&#8217;d like to provide some background for the event. At the State of the Word 2021, Matt announced the WP Photos project. A project to have the WordPress community submit photos for use by anyone in the world for any <span>[00:01:00]</span> purpose. As of today, there are over 15, 000 photos available in the Photos repository.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>The 2024 Photo Festival was an attempt to both boost the number of submitters as well as the number of photos. We begin our story talking with Biggle from Kerala. Biggle, can you tell me your full name and where you live? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:01:27]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Hi, good evening. I&#8217;m Bigul. My full name is e. Malai is my family name.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I&#8217;m from,  South India, southern part of India. I live in a state called Kerala. And my city name is Kozhikode, Calicut. It is one, in the olden time it is very famous for,  what to say, spices. So many European traders came here for trading spices in the past. <span>[00:02:00]</span> </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:02:00]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Were those, were those the Portuguese? Like I know the Portuguese would go up.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:02:04]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Yes, yes, yes. Exactly. He landed here. He was,  then he started the colonization of India. Uh, okay. So the Portuguese came here and before,  Portuguese, we were in trade with Arabs and Chinese,  traders. So,  my city,  has been in touch, direct contact with the,  foreigners, different traders from the world.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>For more than 800 years. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:02:32]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Wow. That&#8217;s really impressive. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:02:34]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> And,  if you, yeah. And for rest of the, my,  state Kerala is in touch with the spice spreading and tea,  lot of,  commodity spread here since the time of Greeks and Romans. Hmm. Maybe you can find,  the, some ships of Ella Malabar coast in,  so,  the Solomon episode of Bible also.<span>[00:03:00]</span> </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:03:00]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Oh, yeah, I&#8217;ll bet. Yeah. Um, so we&#8217;re here today to talk about the WP photos event that happened there Uh, tell me about it. What is it for somebody who doesn&#8217;t know? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:03:13]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Okay. Um photo festival,  as everybody know,  We have no way to contribute back to weight plus since last two years and many people are involved in that project uh, because uh nowadays everyone carry good camera or Mobile.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So we were able to click nice shots wherever we go. So we have a lot of contributors to the,  wait portal directory. There are thousands of contributors and,  uh, from our in Kerala, we have five meetup groups. And most of the time we organized the meetups and where camps together m took at that. So,  uh, we noticed many people from,  our community.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We have a, uh. We have <span>[00:04:00]</span> three active with, with,  WhatsApp group and we have,  five meet groups also. So from there we noticed many,  people in our communities,  actively contributing to WebPress photo directory. And few of them,  the photos were selected in,  in our associated newsletters and uh,  also some other websites related to it.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Press. Uh, especially like a good number of times, zero press, et cetera. So,  as a token of appreciation, people love to contribute more back to the WordPress photos. So,  as per the,  current status, many,  bedcams. Uh, or waitress meetup groups are organizing a photo walk. So be impressed from,  waitress Tokyo group.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And they,  they used to do photo walks very often than other meetup groups. So <span>[00:05:00]</span> we decided to go,  something similar,  but they did so,  A few months back last year,  we went to a botanical garden nearby in Calicut,  that is hardly,  10 kilometers from my native,  I used to go there in the childhood,  because that botanical garden has a lot of,  plants.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>where it is more than thousands of plant varieties, especially they have a garden for ginger and bananas. Uh, it sounds like </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:05:33]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> an ideal place for a photo walk. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:05:35]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Yeah. Yeah. Photo walk. So we&#8217;ve been there and also they have,  they have a very good pond for lotus and, um, water lilies. So And we were able to take a lot of photos there.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And the funny thing is that actually we were only allowed to stay there for three hours, but that day we went there on a Sunday and that day was very rainy day and we were not able to <span>[00:06:00]</span> walk sometime because of the heavy rain. Thankfully, there were some,  kind of a shot,  uh, that way to understand.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>What to say? Some kind of a hut. Yeah. A shed hut, hut, hut, or roughly shed there. So we, we were able to sit there and we were able to talk about WordPress and general web development things. So it&#8217;s like extended a WordPress day. And we were 15 people and, um, Then,  we took more than six hours,  to,  Rob around botanical cat</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And uh, thankfully that day there were a coffee bar nearby, or there is a coffee bar. Actually, they were serving food also in the working days, but Sundays are day for them, so we were able to only able to drink coffee until four evening . Nice. So, but,  the, at. Most of the year was very chilly,  because it is very cool and rain was most of the time it was raining and we were able to take very good <span>[00:07:00]</span> photos.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And I think more than 200 photos from that walk is already in the photo directory by different people. And a few are still remaining to upload those photos. Oh yeah. But still, it is very nice. After seeing,  that in those years from the,  and we also created few reels and . Sure. So it was very successful.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Ah, yeah. When we shared it in the,  our community groups, meetup groups and uh,  WhatsApp group,  we got very good response then,  from the people and they want to be part of that. But,  in, so we thought that if we had taken 20 or 30 people to. Or a botanical garden,  because the photos will be similar,  because there is a limitation.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>There will be many photo duplications. Not sure. Yes. Yes. There are a lot of chances for that. So,  we started to think about how we can have a photo contributed day <span>[00:08:00]</span> and how we can differentiate from a photo market. Then we came with the idea about it. Uh, it was a half day for the contribution day. And we organized it in last year after 23 weeks after the photo book.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, and it went very well. Uh, it it was in last November, and it went very well. We were able to contribute another 200 photos from and most of the participants were different part of Kerala. Uh, so more than 60 people attend that event also. So,  that was a very interesting,  feedback from the people.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And, but,  we,  there were a lot of positive feedbacks and one of the negative feedback was,  they&#8217;re not getting much time to contribute the photo. As we ah know. Uh, we can only upload,  five photo at a time and Right. We have to wait for the moderation. Uh, so we were looking for,  an option how we can, uh.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We can make a remedy for this and <span>[00:09:00]</span> what will be the exact solution for this when we are organizing a photo walk or photo contributor day. So people want to contribute more than 10 or 15 photos. And we have to, we have to consider it as a part of the event, these photo sessions. So we were thinking about different models and Finally, we came up with the idea that still few people don&#8217;t know what, why we should contribute the photos and what are the methods we have to follow, what are the things we have to take care of.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So we decided to have a different format. Uh, we plan to organize a photo festival and it&#8217;s fully dedicated for the contribution of WordPress photo directory. And we decided to. Run it as a one week program on the first day, we organized two orientation, one in the,  Asian morning time zone and one in the hour evening time.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So the people from different <span>[00:10:00]</span> parts of the globe can attend even,  uh, the people from the American side also can attend because it will be early morning for them. So we organized two meetings. One is in the early morning time, time and evening time. So,  more than a hundred people attended both of the meetings,  all in one.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And they, at, they came to,  know more about how we can contribute to the photo directly and what all are the things we have to take her about. What is the relevance of a CCO license, et cetera. Sure. We had a very interactive discussion,  on the both sessions. And people started to contribute and the interesting fact that our goal for this photo festival was 1000 photos to the photo directory in a one week time.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>On the first day itself, there are more than 400 photos submissions. And that is the first time the photo directory is facing that much load. Actually the moderators was busy. For the next one week, <span>[00:11:00]</span> because whenever you look to the photo directory, there will be more than 200 to 50 photos in the queue.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Even on the last day, there were,  we spent a lot of time on Friday and also Saturday morning. And then also there were more than 60 photos,  submitted for our photo festival. So that was an immense response. Our goal actually, as like I mentioned before, our goal was thousand photos, but we were able to.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I mean the pupil sub contributor more than around two, 2000 photos. But as you know, we cannot, there, there are few of the photos around 400 plus photos. Were not up to the mark. They have. Yeah. It always happens. They were matching tower guidelines, so it happens. So we were, we had to reject those photos because they, most of them were not up to the market because of different issues like clarity paid,  et cetera.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So,  in, uh. After that also, even we <span>[00:12:00]</span> rejected 400 plus photos, there were,  thousand 544 photos contributed the WordPress photo directory as a part of that. And,  it is contributed by,  more than 160 contributors from different parts. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:12:16]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> And that&#8217;s, that&#8217;s just within one week.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:12:17]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Right. Yeah, within one week.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Actually, the funny thing is that,  more than 300 people registered for the event, but thankfully only 170 people contributed. Otherwise, it will be a big, big, big, big,  delay will cause that to monitor the photos and moderate the photos. It will take a lot of, lot of time. It will not be possible to sort all the things in a one week time.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So overall, we get a very good feedback and. It is,  it&#8217;s a nice way of contributing back to WordPress. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:12:53]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. Uh, I do know the moderator struggled to keep up because they came in so quickly. Um, at one point <span>[00:13:00]</span> there was, I think a thousand in the queue. Um, I watch personally, I watch every photo go by in an RSS feed just for fun.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And,  there&#8217;s usually 40 or 50 in a day. And I got up over 2000 in my reader before I could start catching up. And so that was crazy. Um, I personally was ill during that time. So I wasn&#8217;t able to moderate or even attend. And so, and I&#8217;m one of the moderators. So,  that put extra weight on some of the others.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, Marcus Burnett is a moderator and he was at a word camp. And so,  it was, it was a pretty stressful time. I don&#8217;t think anybody expected that volume. Um, and it was. It was pleasantly international. Uh, you know, it was India heavy, but that&#8217;s okay. It&#8217;s that was. That&#8217;s your home, your home base. But I saw people from all over the world contributing, and that <span>[00:14:00]</span> was very encouraging.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Um, I&#8217;m excited to see other cities,  other States around the world,  pick up the mantle and. And do something similar, um, sort of like the Olympics, you know, where,  it&#8217;s, it&#8217;s international, but it&#8217;s really about the city. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:14:25]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Yes. Yes. We can consider,  because,  after this,  when we can conclude the photo festival, most of the participants were checking when will be the next event.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So of course we have to think about a bigger vision, maybe next year,  in a bigger manner. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:14:46]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Um, tell me about the future. Have you, have you already thought about,  doing another one yourself? Have you thought about, or has anybody approached you and said, Hey, we&#8217;d like to do this <span>[00:15:00]</span> also. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:15:01]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Yeah, we got a very good feedback from the community because community,  because few approach, I mean, a few community organizers in touch with us, they, they.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>told told us that they will be doing something similar as a part of their webcam. Uh, not in a bigger, bigger manner, but a kind of a smaller version of this. Uh, so I, I hope,  it will be followed by,  many other communities and people want a bigger version of this. Uh, so maybe,  next year we can, we can plan a bigger one.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yeah, I, in a sense, what I mean that,  actually that,  many people contributed more than 30, 40 photos and they want to contribute more. And also the thing is that. They were not getting enough time to contribute as they,  they want because,  many, <span>[00:16:00]</span> uh, participants conducted us through different social media channels, even a few of them contacted us directly, directly because they have our,  phone numbers or WhatsApp numbers.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So they, they ping me directly and say, why my photo is spending queue for last two days. I have tons of photos with me. I want to contribute. I want to contribute. What, well, when you will be moderate. Okay.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:16:25]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Uh, so that&#8217;s, that speaks to some of the logistics that we need to take care of. Yeah. Particularly around moderators.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:16:31]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Yeah. So yes, please carry on, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:16:36]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> but we have enough moderators for daily submissions. It&#8217;s working fine. Yes, exactly. But so that&#8217;s not going to scale. So, yeah, points that out. This is a good stress test for the for the system. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:16:51]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Yes, exactly. So, but we can do that. Uh, we can,  we can in touch with moderators. Uh, in advance.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>If this time <span>[00:17:00]</span> we only pinged them, um, just around two weeks before the event. Next time we can make a,  a long plan and we can ping them in advance, two, three months advance. So they can be ready. They can devote some time on that particular two, three weeks. And we can give people,  more than a week or 10 days or 15 days.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Contributing to the WordPress photo directory. So everybody will get enough time to contribute their good photos to the photo directory. And also,  uh, so there will not be any hurry. So we will get enough submission also. And also as a moderator, we will get enough time to moderate it. And,  for,  for us, it will get enough.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>time to sort out the photos and announce the winners rather than we keep doing in a one or two days. Uh, so,  that is our plan. And also,  many people,  be discussed in person multiple <span>[00:18:00]</span> times. Many people want to contribute to the WordPress photo directory, but they&#8217;re not willing to create an account in WordPress.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>org or they are not willing. Submit the photos one by one and when we, when we were,  sharing this group in a few of the professional photographers we know and they shared it in their WhatsApp group about this. Uh, so immediate response is that, is it possible to send the photos,  send the photos via email?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, so that is the normal practice. Yeah. Normal practice here. Uh, some,  when a online media or a,  regular media conduct the event for the photo festival like this,  for example, nature for the festival or,  by wildlife photograph festival. There are a few photo festivals happens here most of the time.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, by conducted by some organizations or online,  uh, agencies like that. They will only ask them to send the <span>[00:19:00]</span> photos we have made. So they were expecting the same from us. So,  we expect a few,  professional photographers participations, but unfortunately we only get less than 10,  from our state,  because of this.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So next time we will think of a way to include them also. Uh, so we have to work on that. Uh, we need,  if we get one or two volunteer to monitor this, we will surely consider this. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:28]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. I know, I know that there are develop professional developers in the world who became professional developers because of WordPress.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I&#8217;m going to be really curious to see if we get professional photographers. Grow out of this program. Yes, exactly. That would be really great. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:19:49]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Yeah, we are hoping for that also. But there is also another problem is that,  they, they are ready to share a few of them are ready to share, but they are not willing to <span>[00:20:00]</span> share in a license.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:20:02]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Right?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:20:03]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Yes. That is a difficulty. Yeah, that&#8217;s a difficulty. And so at least we missed a few great photos because of that, but we can compromise with that,  because we, that&#8217;s one of the most important thing in our guideline. Sure. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:20:21]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. Um, I&#8217;ve given some thoughts to that and we, I think we as a community need to do a better job of communicating why it&#8217;s worthwhile to, for a professional to submit some photos.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, under the CC zero license, um, they never want to give anything away. It didn&#8217;t make sense. It it&#8217;s their culture. Um, but I think, I think we can convince them that it&#8217;s, that it&#8217;s worth it in some ways. Um, so that&#8217;s, that&#8217;s something we can learn from this project. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:20:56]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Yes. And also,  a few of <span>[00:21:00]</span> the,  Professional photos submitted in our,  Event as a part of this event get wider recognition.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>One of them is,  selected as the 15, 000 photo. Yeah. There was a tweet from Waitress,  Twitter handle about,  15, 000 photos and one of the professional photos submitted as a part of the event is selected for that. Ah, that&#8217;s great. The one, maybe you remember the blue one, um, of uh,  Kingfisher, blue Kingfisher?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yes, I do. It&#8217;s, yeah, it is selected as one of the,  best photos of,  our photo festival. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:21:40]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Ah, that&#8217;s great. Um, I&#8217;d like to talk to you for a few minutes about,  organizers. I noticed you have a lot of them. Mm-Hmm, . Um, my, my local work camp usually had four. What did you have 20 or something like that? <span>[00:22:00]</span> </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:22:00]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Yeah, I actually,  as I told you before,  we conducted, I mean, we organized this event as a,  on the band banner of it, the Scarlet community.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Uh, we have,  uh,  for community with respect to community here. So,  all these organizers from that group. Okay. And they are part of our,  last two, three bedcams also. And we worked as a team since we started. So all of them were part of this event in a different, different way. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:22:32]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> So what kinds of, what kinds of different things did they do?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I mean, okay. So it&#8217;s not a, it&#8217;s not a word camp, so you&#8217;re not getting a venue. You&#8217;re not, you know, all that stuff. What, what did they do for this event? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:22:47]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Um, actually,  most of us were in the part of,  in the initial process itself. So,  as, as I described before, a few minutes before we started it as a <span>[00:23:00]</span> photo walk in the first, then we organized as a photo direct, I mean, a photo contributor after they contributed dates.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Then we decided to go for a photo festival. So all this idea came when we sit together,  in different Zoom calls. So all of them has their own suggestions and we were discussing about the, the, so it took three, four meetings,  That will from a photo up to photo festival. So everyone was part of the discussion and they were sharing their idea in our group.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So, so we have a WhatsApp group and telegram group for this. And also we have a slack group. So we were discussing a lot of things, how to, how to execute in a better manner. So,  a lot of suggestions came from all of these people and, and also they, they shared about this event in their,  all, all possible ways, like,  they&#8217;re in between their friends and <span>[00:24:00]</span> family in between their colleagues.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Okay. In a different way. So that is why we get a wider,  spread of this event in a short time, actually as a part. As a part of our budget, there was,  250 allocated for online campaign,  especially for the Instagram ads. Uh, but,  in the, on the first day, we, our plan was to execute it on, after we,  we organize the first orientation, the first day orientation and to wait for the response, how will be the response.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And thankfully,  we got a very good response on the first day itself because of this,  indirect collaboration with the people like friends, family, colleagues, et cetera. So that helped, that helped a lot. Uh, so we were able to,  do the promotions in a very short,  short time because of this wider <span>[00:25:00]</span> base.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:25:01]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Right. </p>\n\n\n\n<p>I really like that. Um,</p>\n\n\n\n<p>I&#8217;m accustomed to a lead organizer deciding what the tasks are and then assigning them to as many contributors are as needed, which might be four or five or whatever for an event, or at a very large event, maybe, you know, a dozen or so. But I really like the idea of people coming to the meeting and saying, I think we should do this, and I&#8217;m willing to do the work.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And so now I&#8217;m an organizer, you know, um, that&#8217;s very, very,  open source, you know, to come to the group and say, I&#8217;m going to do this work for this project. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:25:47]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Actually, we always tell one thing, we always tell one thing here. Uh, we, we are trying to execute that. Like there is a famous verse from Three Musketeers, one for all, all for one.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:25:59]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> <span>[00:26:00]</span> Yes. Yeah, that&#8217;s really great. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:26:04]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Okay. And also,  uh, the important thing is that we also get a very good support from other Indian community,  like,  for example, maybe you have noticed that,  Sadie has created a. video also pinged us to,  join us a volunteer. Uh, okay. So she created, she created a article,  she write, wrote an article in our,  event,  event site about how to contribute to web water directly with a good video.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So people were able to,  if a people, if a person reading that article,  he or she will be able to,  get a clear understanding of how to contribute to a web photo directory. So, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:26:46]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> uh, that was translated too as well, right? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:26:48]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh, so be conducted. So,  in our internal discussion,  this idea came that,  we can translate this, the article to different Indian languages.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Then we <span>[00:27:00]</span> conducted,  some of our, I mean, most of our community here, and we were able to, um, Translated to multiple languages like Tamil,  Canada, Hindi, Marti,  Gujarati, Bengali, Nepali. Okay. Uh, we have translated these master languages, so,  that&#8217;s really great. Yeah. So it, it,  it gave. , it, it, it helped us to get a,  uh, wider recognition e even in the community, and people were able to read,  read the article in their languages and they were able to,  contribute to the,  photo directory without much hassles.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So,  it helped a lot. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:27:43]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. That&#8217;s, that&#8217;s pretty cool. Um, I interviewed Sadie and,  in a couple of days he&#8217;ll be able to watch. Okay. Nice. The interview about her making that video. Okay. Um, I think that&#8217;s it <span>[00:28:00]</span> for today. Okay. I really appreciate your time. Okay. Thank you very much. Um, you&#8217;ve been very patient throughout the entire interview process.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:09]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> It&#8217;s been a journey for both of us. It&#8217;s a pleasure to talk to you because you are one of our men in the photo. I thank you very much. Actually, we, we, we started to contribute after seeing the efforts you have taken for the photo directory, especially you, Michelle and Marcus. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:31]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Uh, well, thank you very much.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We really appreciate that. It&#8217;s nice to hear. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:36]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> Okay. Thank you very </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:37]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> much. Bigul was not the only organizer by a long shot. There were quite a few. I also interviewed Ajith. So tell me your whole name and where you&#8217;re from. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:28:49]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> Yeah. My name is Ajit R N. So I&#8217;m from Cochin, Kerala. It&#8217;s a Southern state of India.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:29:00]</span> So yeah, basically I live near. Uh in the middle of the sea and the mountains so Okay, it&#8217;s </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:29:08]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> uh, yeah, it&#8217;s on the uh, it&#8217;s on the Western shoreline, right? Yeah. Yeah, that&#8217;s right. Yeah, I know I kind of keep track of things by by their relation to mumbai and I know mumbai is about halfway down on the west And so you guys are like, so halfway between the bottom and Mumbai, right?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:29:30]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> No, actually South actually we are,  no, no, actually we are way below that. So we are the bottom part of the India on the left side. Okay. If you see Yeah. the hot part. . Yeah. . Yeah. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:29:45]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> So, yeah. Okay. So,  tell me what you did with the WP WP Photos event that happened recently. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:29:54]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> Okay. Uh, basically my role was to take care of all the <span>[00:30:00]</span> website and all the design side of things.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So I did most of the website and all the facilitated all the things for the registration. And also we did some small apps to display the live feed of the photos. Oh, nice. Yeah. Right. Yep. Yeah. Also we got some leaderboard too. So anyway, since the event is over, I think that&#8217;s finalized. So yeah. Okay. So basically my role was to mostly doing all the technical stuff, I guess.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So, yeah. Yeah. That&#8217;s it. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:30:38]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. Your title was organizer. Yeah. Yeah. That&#8217;s correct. I was surprised. There are quite a few organizers. What was it like 10 or something like that? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:30:46]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Something like that. So we basically,  we are a group of organizers. So,  whenever there&#8217;s an enemy, we call a meeting and everyone will <span>[00:31:00]</span> input, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:31:00]</span> <strong>Bigul:</strong> uh, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:31:02]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> we will do their parts.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So that&#8217;s it. Yeah, since this was a,  we didn&#8217;t get enough time to prepare all. Uh, prepare for the event. So like we just got approval and in the next one week or one and a half week, we just, there&#8217;s, there&#8217;s only a short amount of window. So most of us didn&#8217;t have free enough time to go through the whole process.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So a bunch of us came together and we did, and yeah, it&#8217;s, that&#8217;s basically. Okay. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:31:43]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Um, Bigger mentioned he was the main point of contact. Well, okay. So I asked him if he was lead organizer and you&#8217;d not say yes. He said it was main point of contact. Was there a lead organizer? Was there one person or was it just like main point of <span>[00:32:00]</span> contact was by default?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Yeah, actually, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:32:03]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> uh, he was, yeah, actually we didn&#8217;t,  specifically any lead organizer, so, because. Actually, initially he came up with this idea, so we all communicate through him and he really, yeah, if, if you say, if you, if he can be said, who is the leader, I think it&#8217;s, we can tell it first, so, yeah, that&#8217;s right.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Anyway, we didn&#8217;t get into that conversation, so we, </p>\n\n\n\n<p>we work as a group. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:32:33]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> All right, that makes sense. Have you, um, organized, been on an organizing team for a WordCamp before? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:32:46]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> Yes, I did. So actually I was part of the two editions of WordCamp Cochin. Okay. And one edition of WordCamp Kerala we conducted last year.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:32:58]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> So my question related <span>[00:33:00]</span> to that is, how is this different from an organizer standpoint? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:33:05]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> Yeah, since this is a purely online event, so there is no interaction with people physically. So basically that was a challenge. In some way, or maybe we can say the, we can cut out a few of our teams. Like we don&#8217;t need to organize a venue or, and all things related to that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So basically, yeah. So anyway, the reason we choose to go for an online event, because since it was basically a contributing photos to the photo directory, and if you do it on one day, we. May not have get enough photo contributions. So if it was a <span>[00:34:00]</span> longer event or an online event, then everyone can participate.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So with their own time. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:34:08]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Okay. So would you say it&#8217;s easier, harder or just different?</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:34:16]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> I think it&#8217;s just different. So it&#8217;s,  not an easy path. So, yeah, so, </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:34:23]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> yeah, I can imagine some parts would be easier and some parts would be harder. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:34:26]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> Yeah, yeah, some parts would be harder. So the organizing the talks and all the things, the interaction between the,  attendees.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So that was a bit different from an in person event. So I&#8217;m not sure if we get enough,  networking experience or networking opportunities. With these online events, so Sure, yeah. That, yeah, that&#8217;s an issue. So, but the easy parties,  like I mentioned before, we don&#8217;t need to worry about the venue and the core setup for <span>[00:35:00]</span> the speakers and all sort of things related to that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So, yeah, that&#8217;s, that makes sense. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:35:07]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. That, yeah, that. Um, let&#8217;s talk about the future a little bit, um, specifically for a photos event, not just virtual, but specifically for a photos event, what would you do differently in the future, especially from your standpoint is as the tech guy, what would you build differently?</p>\n\n\n\n<p>How would you come at it? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:35:30]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> Uh, so I think,  the easiest way is to,  we can build a efficient. A system to, I mean, display the photos. So currently we have some limitations with the API, how we get the photos and display them. So sometimes it&#8217;s harder to get all the info we need in one go or something like that.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>And <span>[00:36:00]</span> the other thing we might need to change is,  if we can accept more photos from a user, but that&#8217;s a Uh, I think it&#8217;s different. So if you get more photos from one person, I think it&#8217;s a bit harder to moderate. So I think the other thing, the one thing I would do differently is,  the, if we can serve first come first,  uh, maybe we can approve the photos of the person who submitted it first.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So maybe that way everyone will get a decent chance. So. Right. Something like that. So, yeah, I think, I know some of the,  photos from the users. So since the Q and the admin is random, so maybe some of the photos of, from a user will come to us to moderate regularly. So, yeah. And I think,  also in the recent update, <span>[00:37:00]</span> they fixed the sorting issue with the date.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So maybe that will help in the future. So, and the other thing,  maybe. Uh, we can,  this, this time, I think we didn&#8217;t get enough time to plan things perfectly. So yeah, we did in the short amount of time we got. And so maybe next year, if we are,  planning to do this kind of event, mostly I think prefer a hybrid kind of event, maybe.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Some if anyone can anyone wanted to attend the event in person, they can and also if it&#8217;s going to be a longer even like this, maybe at one week or something like that. So sure. Yes. Maybe the initial day we can <span>[00:38:00]</span> just gather like a regular webcam and we all have the token. Or the opportunity to do the networking and or some of those things.</p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:38:08]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> So, um, you mentioned more time to prepare. How much did you take? How much did you have? Just one week? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:38:17]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> I think less than two weeks. So that&#8217;s </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:38:19]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> okay. So if I wanted to do one of these myself, I should plan on three or four weeks preparation. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:38:28]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> Yeah, that would be perfect. So I,  the main reason is we need to prepare the site and the contents.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So once it&#8217;s ready, I think,  the rest is,  spread the spreading the information around the community. So what we did was we just reach out to all our friends in the community and they share the or the social media post. So that&#8217;s the, right, that&#8217;s how we get all the attendees. So we didn&#8217;t <span>[00:39:00]</span> do any like,  a promotion or social media advertisement Right.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Or anything like that. So it&#8217;s, it&#8217;s mostly, I I heard that word of mouth, so yeah. That&#8217;s it. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:39:11]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. That was very impressive. And it worked well. It got me, I mean, Yeah, that&#8217;s, that&#8217;s why I was there. Yeah, pretty great. Okay. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:39:21]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> The, the other thing we did differently is we,  translate the how to post in different local languages.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Right. So, yes. So that way we will get more inclusion from different part of the region. So in India,  there is Officially 26 or 30 or something like that. Language is this standard. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:39:47]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> So, right. Yeah. And you personally translated all of them, right? No, no, no, no. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:39:56]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> I think I only can read one or two of the languages.<span>[00:40:00]</span> </p>\n\n\n\n<p>Some I can,  understand and some I can speak. So maybe only I can read and write. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:40:08]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> So, yeah. What are your main, what, what are those two that, you know, are really well? </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:40:13]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> Actually, my,  mother tongue is Malayalam, so. Okay, yeah. Yeah, yeah. So, the other,  I can talk in English, so. Great, yeah. It&#8217;s not an official language in India, anyway.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>But we all speak, communicate in English, since everyone knows it. The other two languages I speak, Tamil. Yeah. So it&#8217;s, yeah. That&#8217;s nearby. And the other is Hindi. Yeah, it&#8217;s nearby. Oh, yeah. And also, yeah, Hindi, so I know a little bit of Hindi. And so, and also I know some Canada or something like that. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:40:48]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Um, I have, I have my translation badge on wordpress.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>org. I have, I have translated WordPress <span>[00:41:00]</span> into Canadian, Australian, and British. Okay.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>That&#8217;s how far multilingual I am. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:41:13]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> Okay. So, all right. So from English. Yeah. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:41:19]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Yeah. Well, thank you very much for your time. I appreciate </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:41:23]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> it. Okay. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:41:24]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Um, and,  I look forward to talking to you, talking to you again. Okay. Good. Sure. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:41:31]</span> <strong>Ajith:</strong> Thank you. All right. </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:41:32]</span> <strong>Topher:</strong> Bye bye. And that&#8217;s our story for today. I hope you enjoyed it. Be sure to stop by tomorrow.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>We&#8217;re going to talk to some volunteers from the event and find out what it&#8217;s like to work at an event where you don&#8217;t really interact with the attendees. Or the organizers or anyone else. What&#8217;s it like to run, not just a virtual event, but a photo walk like </p>\n\n\n\n<p><span>[00:42:00]</span> this. I&#8217;ll see you tomorrow.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Mon, 26 Feb 2024 19:40:31 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:14:\"Topher DeRosia\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}i:49;a:6:{s:4:\"data\";s:13:\"\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n	\n\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";s:5:\"child\";a:2:{s:0:\"\";a:5:{s:5:\"title\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:87:\"WPTavern: WordCamp Canada (WCEH) Announces Call for Speakers, Sponsors &amp; Volunteers\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"guid\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:30:\"https://wptavern.com/?p=154309\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:4:\"link\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:89:\"https://wptavern.com/wordcamp-canada-wceh-announces-call-for-speakers-sponsors-volunteers\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:11:\"description\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:6294:\"<div class=\"wp-block-group has-neutral-100-background-color has-background is-layout-constrained wp-container-core-group-is-layout-1 wp-block-group-is-layout-constrained\">\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">tl;dr</h2>\n\n\n\n<p>The first-ever <a href=\"https://canada.wordcamp.org/2024/\"><strong>WordCamp Canada</strong></a> is callin&#8217; out for Speakers, Sponsors, and Volunteers, ready to bring the community together, post-pandemic style. It&#8217;s a beaut chance for all us Canadians to showcase what makes us unique, from our love for poutine to our bilingual chats, all while diving deep into WordPress, inclusivity, and Indigenous perspectives. So, grab your toque and let&#8217;s make it a good one, buddy!</p>\n\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-spacer\"></div>\n</div>\n\n\n\n<p>Neighbour. </p>\n\n\n\n<p>You have no idea how good it feels to drop that little ‘u’ in there. It’s also a great word to lead into a conversation about the first-ever <a href=\"https://canada.wordcamp.org/2024/\">WordCamp Canada</a> launching its Calls for Speakers, Sponsors, and Volunteers.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Post-COVID many local meetup groups and WordCamps are facing headwinds as the habits of getting together must be re-learned. Facing such headwinds, a group of Canadians has decided that the best way to reboot the community across the country is to host a national WordCamp.</p>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p><em>&#8220;Many meetups fell dormant during the pandemic and we couldn’t keep up. This is an opportunity for those existing communities, as well as those communities yet to come to come together and maybe find their people.[sic]&#8221;</em></p>\n<cite>Shanta, WCEH Organizer</cite></blockquote>\n\n\n\n<p>As a fellow Canadian who loves <a href=\"https://www.britannica.com/topic/poutine\">poutine</a>, wears a <a href=\"https://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/tuque\">toque</a> outside in the winter and has often been described as <a href=\"https://www.bbc.com/travel/article/20150311-can-canada-teach-the-rest-of-us-to-be-nicer\">nice</a>, I’m excited to see us celebrating our national identity and inviting others to participate.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>With WordCamp US a regular event, you may be wondering why the Canadians felt the need to have something similar. After all, they’re right next to each other and it’s not difficult to travel between the two countries.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p>Welcome to the conundrum that is being Canadian. Because we are different. It is different here and how we view the world, technology and our role in all of it is also different.&nbsp;</p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"https://www.queensu.ca/strathy/sites/stratwww/files/uploaded_files/publications/volume8/Barr-Gillberry-Wp8.pdf\">Sorry</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p><em>“Many think we’re the same, but we face some very different challenges, including those challenges because we are so close to the US. [WCEH] gives Canadians and Canadian companies the chance to shine. When many of those companies would get swept up at places like WCUS, they can shine at WCEH!”</em></p>\n<cite>Shanta, WCEH Organizer</cite></blockquote>\n\n\n\n<p>Our roads are bumpier and we drink milk from bags. We’re an officially bilingual country where the <a href=\"https://www12.statcan.gc.ca/census-recensement/2021/as-sa/98-200-X/2021013/98-200-X2021013-eng.cfm\">majority speak one language</a>. We’re open to immigration in ways that might intimidate other countries (humble brag). </p>\n\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-spacer\"></div>\n\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-embed__wrapper\">\n<blockquote class=\"twitter-tweet\"><p lang=\"en\" dir=\"ltr\">Stunned by the size of these giant milk bags sold in supermarkets in <a href=\"https://twitter.com/hashtag/Canada?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw\">#Canada</a>! <a href=\"https://twitter.com/hashtag/milk?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw\">#milk</a> <a href=\"https://twitter.com/hashtag/travel?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw\">#travel</a> <a href=\"https://t.co/HDVKVDicqo\">pic.twitter.com/HDVKVDicqo</a></p>&mdash; Carol C (@carolchan9394) <a href=\"https://twitter.com/carolchan9394/status/911077079382462465?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw\">September 22, 2017</a></blockquote>\n</div>\n\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-spacer\"></div>\n\n\n\n<p>While many outside of Canada view it as a <a href=\"https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/maple-syrup-vault-tour-1.6279797\">maple syrup-hoarding</a> place of multiculturalism and inclusivity, we’re also reckoning with our colonial past and our treatment of Indigenous Peoples and <a href=\"https://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/racialized-minorities\">racialized Canadians</a>.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>To keep this national conversation at the forefront, the <a href=\"https://canada.wordcamp.org/2024/call-for-speakers/\">Call for Speakers</a> at WordCamp Canada has placed particular emphasis on topics related to accessibility, underrepresented voices, multilingualism and indigenous communities.</p>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p><em>“[There] exists an increasing acknowledgement of the need for conscious efforts towards “<a href=\"https://www.rcaanc-cirnac.gc.ca/eng/1450124405592/1529106060525\">a renewed nation-to-nation relationship with Indigenous Peoples based on recognition of rights, respect, cooperation and partnership.”</a> This has informed our desire to focus on indigenous empowerment and perspectives, as well as accessibility, inclusivity, and underrepresented communities in general.”</em></p>\n<cite>Paul &amp; Gina, WCEH Organizers</cite></blockquote>\n\n\n\n<p>The organizing team also expressed their interest in exploring how Open Source and WordPress ideals intersect with Indigenous principles. I’m personally excited to see a WordCamp place particular emphasis on these kinds of topics, it feels very, um, Canadian. Perhaps that’s the point.</p>\n\n\n\n<p>So <a href=\"https://foreignlingo.com/canadian-slang-for-friend/\">buddy</a>, if you’re looking for a WordCamp to put on your calendar, join me and my fellow <a href=\"https://www.yukon-news.com/letters-opinions/a-beginners-guide-to-moose-herding-6967796\">moose-herding</a> canucks in my hometown of Ottawa, Canada this July 11-13 for the inaugural WordCamp Canada.</p>\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}s:7:\"pubDate\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:31:\"Mon, 26 Feb 2024 15:36:15 +0000\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}s:32:\"http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/\";a:1:{s:7:\"creator\";a:1:{i:0;a:5:{s:4:\"data\";s:12:\"James Giroux\";s:7:\"attribs\";a:0:{}s:8:\"xml_base\";s:0:\"\";s:17:\"xml_base_explicit\";b:0;s:8:\"xml_lang\";s:0:\"\";}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}s:4:\"type\";i:128;s:7:\"headers\";O:48:\"WpOrg\\Requests\\Utility\\CaseInsensitiveDictionary\":1:{s:7:\"\0*\0data\";a:9:{s:6:\"server\";s:5:\"nginx\";s:4:\"date\";s:29:\"Thu, 14 Mar 2024 19:18:49 GMT\";s:12:\"content-type\";s:8:\"text/xml\";s:13:\"last-modified\";s:29:\"Thu, 14 Mar 2024 19:00:30 GMT\";s:4:\"vary\";s:15:\"Accept-Encoding\";s:15:\"x-frame-options\";s:10:\"SAMEORIGIN\";s:16:\"content-encoding\";s:2:\"br\";s:7:\"alt-svc\";s:19:\"h3=\":443\"; ma=86400\";s:4:\"x-nc\";s:9:\"HIT ord 2\";}}s:5:\"build\";s:14:\"20211220193300\";}', 'no');
